Where is starter solenoid burning?
Photos of burnt part?
Do you have videos of where smoke is coming from?

 

On the other side.

There was no fire or smoke (I stopped first), but when I touched it, it melted my finger

 

Does it only heat up when you crank starter?
Does it cool down after 5-minutes of idling?

Is there only battery cable connected to B terminal?
Is there only starter cable connected to M terminal?

cables look really bad with strange goop on them. Remove and clean off cable terminals completely. Only metal-to-metal contact on big solenoid terminals.

 

yes, it only gets hot when I try to turn it on then it cools down.

I don't know which are b and m, the right one is the positive pole cable that comes from the battery, the left one I think goes to the starter motor, on the positive there is another cable that I seem to remember goes to the circuit breaker (which I don't know if it works).

Can you figure something out from these other photos?

 

Might be load issue? Starter motor only draws as much current as needed to spin engine.
Small 250 engines will require less power; maybe 20amps. Larger 1300 engines will require 90-100amps.

Let’s verify your engine doesn’t have extra drag.

1. gearbox in neutral
2. remove flywheel cover
3. spin engine forward with wrench on crank

Does engine spin freely with occassional resistance from piston’s compression?

 

Could be internal carbon tracking holding solenoid in, this will cause the wires to get overheated

 

Remove feed from starter relay to starter, both ends ,check resistance of starter feed line, should be almost no resistance on meter. If higher ohms ,could be corosion in feed line,high resistance will cause higher amperage across starter relay contacts and overheating of contacts. also check resistance across relay contacts make sure they are not burned.again burned contacts higher amps and heat

 

This picture appears to show corroded cable ends.

This resistance changes some of flowing electricity to heat and robs starter of power. I prefer to seal ends of cables with solder to prevent moisture from creeping down between wire-strands to cause green/black wire disease.

 

I bet under that electrical tape is big time corrosion

 

I suggest hooking up a voltmeter to the battery check voltage as you crank the engine over and see how much voltage the starter is requiring while cranking sounds to me like a bad starter drawing to many amps.

 

We need OP to do a voltage drop test to see what is going on for sure, I would first clean all those cables, open up that electrical tape and see what is going on there

 

thanks for all these answers.

Today I did another test after charging the battery all night, worse than yesterday...

I understand that the most suggested solution is to clean the cables and contacts, tomorrow I'll try to disassemble and clean everything, maybe even with a little wd40.

Unfortunately I'm in Las Terrenas in the Dominican Republic, we have sea, sun, salt, humidity, rain, anything that can help oxidation and corrosion we have it, and the cables are probably the original ones from 40 years ago... let's hope a little cleaning is enough.

I'll also look for a tester, I don't have one because I don't understand anything about electricity but I'm afraid I know that the light that dims so much is not a good sign, right?

 

not so good, but not so bad either.

I cleaned the contacts on the solenoid with sandpaper today.

Unfortunately not much has changed

 

not so good, but not so bad either.
View attachment 94551 View attachment 94552

I cleaned the contacts on the solenoid with sandpaper today.

View attachment 94553 View attachment 94554

Unfortunately not much has changed
We

No it’s very, very bad. These are definitely not factory OEM stock cables. Something poorly crafted by blind raccoons in dark basement sweatshops.

Extremely corroded cables with green/black wire disease. There is surface corrosion on all wire strands. Terminals are very loose (+pos terminal is not even crimped) with lots of air-space between strands that allow moisture down inside wire and cause corrosion. Yellow ground wire has undersized terminal and hole has been expanded, resulting in extremely small contact surface area with solenoid.

Heat is caused by resistance when electricity has to go from inside wire strands, across surface-corrosion, then across surface corrosion inside terminals then to solenoid posts. Due to limited contact surface-area between wire-strands and inside of terminal, what is actually touching has to transmit ALL power, leading to overloading and even more extra heat.

You need to completely disassemble terminals without breaking them, sand off corrosion all around each and every wire strand. Also sand inside of terminals so clean wires touches clean metal surface. Then do proper OD compression of terminals that squeezes all air out from between wire strands (solder conducts electricity better than air).

Here’s how I built heavy-duty battery cables as part of headlight + relay harness kit.

1. First, lugs for cable is crimped to squeeze inwards forcing all air space out​

​

2. then solder is added to inside of lug to prevent moisture from creeping down cable innards. Also improves conductivity (less heat) because it increases contact surface area between wire-strands to inside of lug. Remember, solder conducts electricity better than air.​

​

3. add adhesive heat-shrink wrap and seal with heat.​

Later, I got hydraulic hex-crimper and it does really, really good job of squeezing out air from between wire-strands. I still solder to increase contact surface area and seal remaining air space from moisture. Because solder between wires conduct electricity better than air.

I gave 50-yr warranty on these cables. it’s been 30-yrs and not single one has come back. People remove them from car when selling and transfer to new car. I often see them selling on eBay for double original price.

You can certainly fabricate similar top-quality cables like these using 0-gauge welding cable (cheap) and solder-lugs. How far away are you from Santo Domingo? Compañia Dominica de Telefonos is one of my clients. I can ask if they will sell you supplies to make your own cables. Or even make them for you to purchase. Probably private side-project for engineer on weekend. Actually, any competent garage can build these cables to top-specs easily.

 

.

 

Don't waste your time,on the battery,it may be wasted already, replace both cables to the starter as DannoXYZ said . If doing cables yourself ,make sure of proper gauge , and follow instructions by Danno, they are spot on. In the end you may still need battery.

 

Yeah, weak battery is just victim or symptoms/side-effect of cable problems, not cause of problem. There was guy that came here about 2-years ago after replacing battery 7 TIMES!!! Real problem was broken charging system.

 

For a year now I have been trying to redo these cables, but I haven't even been able to find the cable here, there are no competent or equipped workshops that can make them within hundreds of kilometers.

Today after DannoXYZ talked about telephony I saw a little man on the telephone antenna next to my house, I went to ask where I could find cables and terminals and he gave me some.

So now my entire arsenal for redoing cables is this.

Scissors, pliers and a small soldering iron, tomorrow I will try to disassemble them and see how many and which ones I can redo, probably positive and negative, for the starter motor cable I need to at least find a thermal sheath first.

I would like to be able to at least come up with a temporary solution to understand if with new cables the bike starts or if I also have to change the battery or look for further problems.

Then I would really like to get in touch with DannoXYZ customers to create more serious and definitive cables (here it's hell to find people or workshops, they don't have websites, yellow pages, nothing, either you know them or you'll never find them), but I fear they will have to send me the material because both positive and negative have other cables connected and I don't know if I can remove the one from the circuit breaker. Santo Domingo is not close but here they ship everything with the guagua (small bus).

P.S. Today I removed the battery and also cleaned the contacts on the battery, nothing changed, but I noticed that in an instant the cables for about ten centimeters also heat up, both positive and negative.

 

For a year now I have been trying to redo these cables, but I haven't even been able to find the cable here, there are no competent or equipped workshops that can make them within hundreds of kilometers.

Today after DannoXYZ talked about telephony I saw a little man on the telephone antenna next to my house, I went to ask where I could find cables and terminals and he gave me some.

So now my entire arsenal for redoing cables is this.
View attachment 94598

Scissors, pliers and a small soldering iron, tomorrow I will try to disassemble them and see how many and which ones I can redo, probably positive and negative, for the starter motor cable I need to at least find a thermal sheath first.

I would like to be able to at least come up with a temporary solution to understand if with new cables the bike starts or if I also have to change the battery or look for further problems.

Then I would really like to get in touch with DannoXYZ customers to create more serious and definitive cables (here it's hell to find people or workshops, they don't have websites, yellow pages, nothing, either you know them or you'll never find them), but I fear they will have to send me the material because both positive and negative have other cables connected and I don't know if I can remove the one from the circuit breaker. Santo Domingo is not close but here they ship everything with the guagua (small bus).

P.S. Today I removed the battery and also cleaned the contacts on the battery, nothing changed, but I noticed that in an instant the cables for about ten centimeters also heat up, both positive and negative.

That looks like good starting point... heh, heh....

You'll still need to find thicker 0-gauge cable in order to transmit required power. You can re-use old cable by removing terminal and carefully sanding off corrosion from every single strand of wire. Another method to increasing current-capacity is to join multiple smaller wires together. You need at least 4 of smaller wire you posted and crimp them all into 1 solder-lug (ignore right side of photo).

Also need cigarette lighter or small torche to heat up solder-lug. Soldering iron won't provide enough heat since large size of solder-lug will suck heat away too quickly. Don't use those ring-terminals, they're too small.


There's 3 different requirements for good joint, they're not interchangeable:

1. mechanical strength - good crimp that shrinks OD of solder-lug inward and squeezes all air out. Cannot use solder or any other method​

​

2. electrical conductivity - replace air between wire-strands and terminal with solder. Increases contact-surface area around wire and reduces heat and corrosion.​

​

3. corrosion resistance - solder will help prevent wicking moisture from wire-end, but there's still expose area past solder-lug. Adhesive heatshrink tubing works best here​

​

Here is good example of crimp with good 1. mechanical strength.

 

View attachment 94599

 

so, I'm a bit stuck, I've done some tests with the cables with the tools I have, with disastrous results, I really risk doing a much worse job than what there is, and to do that I have to destroy the cables I have.

iIn the meantime, however, a friend lent me a tester (voltmeter), the problem is that I don't know how to use it... I managed to measure the battery and it seems good to me, but more than that I don't know how to do.

Can you help me understand how to use it at least to identify in more detail or in which cable or electrical component the problem is?

 

That's good testing with multimetre. After 24-hrs resting, 12.61 volt resting is ok. You want to make 2nd test of battery-voltage during cranking. Difference between these 2 measurements will tell lots.

You want to see 13.5v fresh off trickle charger, you need one of those. To charge up battery after many cranking sessions. Battery will get destroyed if you drain it too low and not charge it right away.

You also need good squeezing crimpers that squeezes terminal inwards to remove air. Smashing terminal does not squeeze OD inwards and does not make strong joint for mechanical strength. Nor does that remove air from between wire-strands for more contact surface area for electrical conductivity. Here is basic hex squeezing crimper. I prefer hydraulic, but costs more.
https://www.icrimptools.com/product...-duty-copper-wire-lugs-battery-cable-ends-from-awg-8-1-0-ground-lug-cimper-tool
Or you can us 2 of these in vise, but ends up costing more than crimper
https://www.speedwaymotors.com/American-Autowire-500665-Crimping-Tool-Battery-Cable,373883.html

You will also need some soldering-flux to prep cables for soldering into lugs. Can use plumbing flux for copper.

Let me contact people in Santo Domingo to see if they can recommend electrical supply house for you to get required tools and cable. Unfortunately, tools and equipment to properly make cables will end up costing many times the cables themselves.

 

Today's test, battery while starting the bike.

i don't know... right or wrong? How bad? What could it be?
(the smoke was made by the negative cable which melted the plastic of the battery as it heated up)

For the cables, I don't just need a decent pliers, the cables I found are too small for the terminals, there could be three in the terminal, a despair.

 

I noticed at the end of your video you could move the negative cable around by hand. This very loose connection of the cable to the battery terminal is also a very high resistance connection. Battery connections need to be tight and provide low resistance. The heat and smoke were caused by that loose connection.

 

You are dropping way too voltage from battery when cranking ~5v. Want to see no less than 10v for carby or 11v for EFI bikes. Less than that and there won't be spark to ignite mixtures. You have combination of two possible causes:

1. weakened battery due to too many cranks without adequate charging in between. You need to connect trickle charger to battery ASAP.

2. some battery power is converted to heat on way to starter from cable corrosion. Robs power from starter and it runs too slowly.

Yes. you need larger cables. If you have sufficient length, you can cut those wires into 3rd or 4ths and combine all segments into single terminal to triple, quadruple current capacity and lower heat. Along with proper crimping and soldering.

 

I have some updates...

a supposed mechanic came with a battery, we tried to start the bike with his battery but no change, then he connected the positive on the starter motor and (he says) tested the starter motor, the verdict was "it's the starter motor".

I took out the original starter motor of the bike (changed about a year ago because of another mechanic that changed parts randomly), to my great surprise I found a starter motor cable tucked into the flaps of the box (about twenty years younger than mine).

I tested the two starter motors and indeed the original starter motor seemed to be a little "cheerful" than the one on the bike.

I changed the starter motor and cable, tried to start, but nothing, it doesn't start, the original starter motor seems to make a couple of turns more than the other, but the bike doesn't start.

I also tried adding a new cable in parallel next to the positive, but no change.

I've also asked everyone that work with cables for new cables and terminals, but nothing, no one seems to even know where to buy a piece of cable around here, they use what they find in the hardware store.


Trudy doesn't turn on, and I don't know what to do anymore

 

I have a suzuki 800 intruder ,the battery leads are #6 gauge wire, try to buy on amazon, or look up #6 gauge strander wire on line , buy connector,replace positive and negative leads, then charge battery 12.8 volt-13.2 good, then try to start taking voltage reading from positive terminal to ground. if voltage drops below 10.5 volts ,battery is shot,replace battery. If you don't replace leads you are wasting your time,as DannoXYZ has be telling you. Best of luck

 

Did you measure mechanic's battery? Might be just as dead as yours if starter's behavior is same as yours. Let's add one more test to verify where problem lies:

1. battery power with everything off, volts=???​

2. battery power when cranking, volts=???​

3. power at starter +pos terminal when cranking, volts=???​

Post photos of this new hidden battery cable you found. Is it connected to anything?

 

I'm not entirely sure I understood what you asked, so I filmed everything, before, after, during, everything...

This is the starter cable I found (softer than the old one).

To redo the other cables is a bit of a mess... they are not single, the circuit breaker also goes into the positive cable, the negative is 3 cables, one with a faston terminal, the other bullet terminal... I have no hope of being able to redo them here (I can't find cables, terminals, pliers, nothing...)

I could order just two single cables on Amazon and then rebuild the others with another cable and terminal, but even ordering from Amazon is a mess, there is no postal service or addresses here, everything has to be sent to delivery services in Miami and then transported and sorted in the Dominican Republic, and half of the objects are lost and the other half are stolen, and the costs are random and always different (I had to buy headphones for the helmet 3 times before I managed to get one)

DannoXYZ, you told me that you have contacts with the Dominican telephone companies, can we contact them to at least understand if they can and if they want to try to make the cables?