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Discussion Starter #1
Could I replace my entire electrical system with a universal one, is there even such a thing?

Like a new multifunction box, lights, horn, turn signals and then kill switch, and electric starter, all the associated cables, and relays, and just essentially rewire the bike?

The last owner of my bike spliced a ton of wires and taped them back together in what looks like a very haphazard way. Its a hot mess.


Battery loses charge if sitting connected all night. It just slowly starts draining.
Also the electric starter doesn't even try to function even at full charge. The battery is good, I had it tested. The electric starter was working but now wont do a thing. I'm going to check for shorts this weekend.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
You sir, are an amazing person. Thank you so much for not only answering the question but simplifying it, and directing me to a product I will definitely buy. Thank you so much.:71baldboy:
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Ok so today I was finally able to go out and work out the bike. It turns out that the wires from the relay to the solenoid were bad. I patched them up and now the bike cranks every time i hit the ignition switch but doesn't start. I pulled off the spark plug cap and noticed its not fitting snug to the spark plug and noticed also that the spark plug was hand tightened in the socket meaning i could just pull it out without any force.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I found one online called..

thunderheart.
Is this a serious response or not? Im new to all of this motorcycle repair and all but if this is a good harness then i might buy it, but if you are joking then obviously I will steer clear.
 

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Ok, so you want to diagose a no-start now?

First, check the fuel tank make sure it's not empty. Or just add a gallon of fresh and then you don't have to think about whether there's "enough."

Next, get a can of starting fluid, brake cleaner, any FLAMMABLE aerosol....I've even used hair spray in a roadside McGuyver...

(I don't recommend that as it will gum up the mass airflow sensor...)

Take off your air filter, spray some in as you crank the bike. If it catches and starts, you've got a lack of fuel problem. As long as you keep spritzing it should continue to run.

If it doesn't start on faux fuel, stick a screwdriver into the spark plug boot and hold it 1/4" from the plug as you or someone else cranks. If you don't see a spark, you've got an ignition problem.

If you've never done this before, be sure and get a friend to record this on video just in case you fail to hold the screwdriver by the INSULATED handle. Makes hilarious Youtube --- Noob checks motorcycle for Spark the hard way!

It's the GM HEI--- high energy ignition, putting out well over 50,000V that will really :light up: a novice auto tech. Ask me how I know this....

Got spark but still no start? Pull the plug(s) out. If its wet with fuel, dry it in the sun or with compressed air. Wire brush any carbon off, check the gap as long as you've got it out.

Put your finger over the hole and crank. You should feel it trying to blow your finger off the hole as it comes up on the compression stroke. No compression? Try a squirt of oil down the hole and crank again.

Still no compression? Possibly a stuck valve!

Air, fuel, compression, well-timed spark, those are the things an engine needs to start. Determine which one you don't have!

Ahh, what's the history on this bike? When was the last time it ran?
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Ok, so you want to diagose a no-start now?

First, check the fuel tank make sure it's not empty. Or just add a gallon of fresh and then you don't have to think about whether there's "enough."

Next, get a can of starting fluid, brake cleaner, any FLAMMABLE aerosol....I've even used hair spray in a roadside McGuyver...

(I don't recommend that as it will gum up the mass airflow sensor...)

Take off your air filter, spray some in as you crank the bike. If it catches and starts, you've got a lack of fuel problem. As long as you keep spritzing it should continue to run.

If it doesn't start on faux fuel, stick a screwdriver into the spark plug boot and hold it 1/4" from the plug as you or someone else cranks. If you don't see a spark, you've got an ignition problem.

If you've never done this before, be sure and get a friend to record this on video just in case you fail to hold the screwdriver by the INSULATED handle. Makes hilarious Youtube --- Noob checks motorcycle for Spark the hard way!

It's the GM HEI--- high energy ignition, putting out well over 50,000V that will really :light up: a novice auto tech. Ask me how I know this....

Got spark but still no start? Pull the plug(s) out. If its wet with fuel, dry it in the sun or with compressed air. Wire brush any carbon off, check the gap as long as you've got it out.

Put your finger over the hole and crank. You should feel it trying to blow your finger off the hole as it comes up on the compression stroke. No compression? Try a squirt of oil down the hole and crank again.

Still no compression? Possibly a stuck valve!

Air, fuel, compression, well-timed spark, those are the things an engine needs to start. Determine which one you don't have!

Ahh, what's the history on this bike? When was the last time it ran?


Thanks! Well the history on the bike isnt 100% clear. Its a 2003 UM renegade 200. I picked it up for 200 bucks from an older gentleman who had a ton of bikes in a garage he worked on but had a heart attack and he was forced to just sell them all for whatever her can get.

The engine would run and run great the electrical system was what was broke originally. I took it as a project bike. When I got it it was running and i even took it for a couple of loops around my apartment complex.

The wiring is butchered but was patched together. It was a good for me though because It taught me how to voltage drop test. :) The wires from the solenoid to the ignition came loose slightly and so it would no crank no start. I fixed that. I am going to replace the hole harness in a week or two.

Now... Before the wiring came loose, the bike would start up easy everytime except one time i cranked it and it was cranking but it felt like it just wouldnt start. I thought (as this was like 4 days after I had the bike) that it was a low battery and the gentleman told me the bike drained batteries for SOME reason. lol. I recharged it on a slow trickle charger and then put it back in.
Turned it on, cranked it, and it started right up.

Then a couple days after that it wouldn't crank or start. Thats when I found the loose connection, and fixed it.

Now we are at the no start.
 

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the gentleman told me the bike drained batteries for SOME reason
Ahh, so NEXT you want to diagnose a parasitic drain.

You're gonna need a working DMM. One that someone hasn't blown the internal fuse on already by trying to take a VOLTS measurement with the meter set on AMPS.

It'll speed testing up considerably if you'll make a four foot alligator clip out of some 12-10AWG wire, or 110V "lamp cord", with one of those mid-sized alligator clips that will clamp onto a battery post on one end, and a itty-bitty alligator clip on the other end - to grab onto your meter's test lead.

You're basically going to be disconnecting one of the battery terminals, putting your meter on (its maximum) 10A setting, and putting the meter's probes BETWEEN the battery post and the battery terminal you just took off.

then you dial the meter down to where you see the draw...10 A, 1A, 100mA...

Then you start pulling fuses until you identify WHICH CIRCUIT is causing the parasitic draw...in the range of 50-300 mA, usually.

Sometimes the draw is on an UNFUSED circuit....

You can tell how bad a parasitic draw is by how fast it flattens the battery. A 50mA draw will flatten it in 2-3 weeks, 100mA one week, 200mA, two days APPROXIMATELY...

More details once you've diagnosed the NO START.
 

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I am not gonna try to disagree with WN--hey the guy is an EE. Just let me share the one tool I wish I had when I started working on motorcycles.

The tool that I bought for myself that I really like for checking spark is a timing light. Harbor freight sells two of them and you can get the best one with a coupon and that makes it affordable. I basically like it because I can see each time the spark misses even if it is one in a hundred. No chance of that bike lighting you up either.

I have a cheap lawn mower spark checker,but the timing light is worlds above that in accuracy and ease of use. An old car mechanic once used his timing light to show me that my little 100cc bike was sparking,but the spark got weak as it heated up. The timing light even shows the relative strength of that spark and since the spark plug is more difficult to fire inside a compressed piston,it makes it a good tool to have to show what is actually happening inside the engine.

Good luck

Post #9 is very informative to me and I might have some questions about it later--thanks.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
So an update...



I got to do a little work on the bike today. I did the spark plug hole test today for the pressure and the pressure would blow my finger away from the hole every time. So I think the pressure is good. I didnt get to do the air filter test but I am sure that fuel is not an issue. The reason I believe is this because I might have found the issue, though I am unsure what is the cause.

I am not getting a spark. I put the plug to metal and It didn't happen. At all. No matter what I did it wouldn't spark. I saw the inside of the spark plug cap and the metal inside looked kinda chewed up from hard use so I replaced the cap but still no spark. I took the ignition cable to a technician in a city over and asked if he had one and he took the cable and said 'these things do not break often. Are you sure its broke?' He then tested it in front of me and sure enough it looked good. Tested it with a multimeter. Forgive me as I am sure you all know that but I am a noob. :(

Anyways, the kill switch is kind of had to read so I even thought like, 'what if i have it on kill' so i fiddled with it and tried to crank the bike on different settings. Still no spark. Curious...would the bike being on kill really effect the spark? Just wondering.

Anyways that is were we are at. Also I might have fixed the power drain issue. Its reading the same battery power level after a day.
 
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