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Very Famous Person
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While these are items that a new rider should learn in three days of classes, it's still a lot of info. Hello!! Information Overload!!

I think the material should be presented in a different manner, but then I don't always agree with committees that design things that they aren't participants in.

I recently resigned from being an ATV Safety Institute safety instructor just for that reason. I don't agree that everyone can learn 100 points of info in 4 hours. My idea is to take the most important things to be known and reinforce them.

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Discussion Starter #3
No good deed goes unpunished, eh? Just sharing a resource here...compiled by the MSF (not me). I just scanned and uploaded, nothing more. ;)
 

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Oh - then apologies for misinterpreting. The philosophy of teaching this much content in a 4 hour class contradicts my principles too. It clearly is designed with self-study in mind, assuming that riders either:

1. Already know the info and just need a refresher, or
2. Riders have already obtained the knowledge needed through alternative methods (first hand experience, online resources, etc.)

That's the thing - these study questions are great questions, but in a 4 hour class I'd be hard pressed to cover 1/4th of them with any degree of detail sufficiently. Four hours is 240 minutes, and you want me to cover 175 questions? That's 90 seconds per question (roughly)... In a class of ten students, each person gets 9 seconds to get their thoughts out?!?!?!

Most people would have trouble getting their name, job, and marital status out of their mouth in 9 seconds in a public speaking environment. It is definitely a setup to failure absent study outside the classroom...
 

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The vast majority of students pass the written test portion of the class. I'm not sure how many absorb everything presented, but most are learning enough to get by the written exam.
It is a lot of material to cover in a weekend both on and off the range. It's the bare minimum a new rider should know to start off riding.
 

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Very Famous Person
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Understand I am only estimating the number of points of info for an ATV safety class in four hours. The MSF course is different in having a class and parking lot and has more hours. Still, a person can only retain so much info in a short cram session.

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I always try to impress on the students that it is only the beginning of their motorcycle learning. The workbooks are theirs to keep and study and have all the answers to the 175 questions covered in the classroom material.

The parking lot exercises provide the basis to use the same skills at higher speeds, and an example of what should be practiced regularly.
 

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My instructor was a meanie and gave us homework, he gave us a few questions that weren't in the book and we had to read the book to find the answer. I guess it is his way of making people read the book. We had to know what page it was on, what paragraph, so even if we knew the answer, we still had to look for it.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
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Understand I am only estimating the number of points of info for an ATV safety class in four hours. The MSF course is different in having a class and parking lot and has more hours. Still, a person can only retain so much info in a short cram session.

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This is precisely why higher education usually limits blocks of instruction to 50 minutes. An adult learner reaches a capacity at which they mentally just shut off because you can only absorb so much in any given period of time. There have actually be a number of studies done that have validated the capacity for learning...younger ages can go for longer periods and can absorb more (hence why it's always better to learn things when you are younger...whether it's biking, languages, math, or anything).

This speaks volumes to the nature of the curriculum which came under scrutiny in another thread, and in the interests of brevity, I will not rehash that here, but when it comes to any short course on anything, in general, they only really scratch the surface and teach you just enough to get you into trouble. Not a fan of these crash course styles of instruction (pardon the pun). The same holds for:

Motorcycle Courses
Driver Education Classes
SCUBA diving classes
Firearms Safety classes (concealed carry classes)

These are silly little song and dance routines that the bureaucratic establishment has enacted simply to generate revenue and to give a false sense of "safety" to those who take these classes. They really teach you nothing you can't learn on your own. This, of course, takes us back to the concept of active learning and passive learning. Most who take courses like the ones listed above are simply doing it to fulfill some state-mandated requirement before they can do something, whether it's ride a bike, drive a car, go scuba diving, carry a concealed firearm, or any other subject matter.

The truth of it is that anything you do in life comes with risks. You can attenuate those risks by pursuing education, practicing safely, and overall, just using some common sense. Some out there have decided that common sense is not all that common anymore (which does have some merit) so we now have classes in how to do basic skills.

Take a BRC to learn how to drive a motorcycle
Take a SCUBA class to learn how to dive
Take a CCW class and you can carry a firearm
Take a programming class and you can write programs

None of these skills are fully developed upon completion - it's a foundation on which to build. The problem is that most think the education ends there, but it doesn't - it's a lifelong process.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
My instructor was a meanie and gave us homework, he gave us a few questions that weren't in the book and we had to read the book to find the answer. I guess it is his way of making people read the book. We had to know what page it was on, what paragraph, so even if we knew the answer, we still had to look for it.
I like that!
 
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