Delusional cooperation

OSfllwr · 01-07-2007, 09:43 PM

The things in Iraq took yet another wrong turn when Bush forced Maliki to meet him in Jordan. The meeting did not help Republicans in the elections, but broke the Iraqi coalition. The faction of Shiite cleric al-Sadr walked out of the government coalition, as promised, because of the meeting.

No one in Iraq has a slightest doubt that Maliki is an American quisling. That’s ok with the people. In Muslims countries, rulers are not expected to represent population; the US and the Qaeda each tries to change that. Muslims are very extroversive and value fac,ade and rituals. Maliki could be a puppet, but he should behave like a tiger – Iraqi tiger. At least, Maliki managed to skip social meeting with Bush and Jordanian King Abdullah (Olmert ignored Arab mentality and met Abdullah several times, a PR disaster).

If that attention to rituals looks silly to rational Americans, it probably is. But that’s how it works in the region. To reach an agreement with Iraqis – rather than simply punish the Baathist state – the US negotiators would have to sit hours and days with various Iraqis, both bureaucrats and radicals, drinking super-sweet Iranian tea, chain-smoking on par with their opponents and talking, talking, and talking. That might or might not bring the desired results, but no other approach could deliver a stable, moderate, US-friendly Iraq.

To please his American masters, Maliki brought together fictitious coalition. Its Shiite faction does not include al-Sadr’s group, the main Shiite organization. It includes only a minor Sunni party, also non-representative. The coalition is advertised as moderate, but listen to the names: Sunni Iraqi Islamic Party (sectarians), the Supreme Council for the Islamic Revolution (sic) in Iraq, and Patriotic Union of Kurdistan (separatist organization, as the name makes clear).

The coalition is meant to squeeze Sadr out of politics. He would indeed go – into the urban battlefields. Sadr could show himself a good Muslim, promise to step down the fighting – and use the truce to train his forces. He needs time to grow the Mahdi gang into an army.

Sistani’s approval won’t cement the coalition. He is merely a religious authority. Religious power in Islam is very dispersed because every cleric and theoretically every Muslim could pronounce fatwas. People go along with famous clerics insofar as they opportunistically serve the mob’s wishes. Sistani cannot afford to condemn fighting the Sunnis, thus his blessing of the coalition could only be half-hearted. Moreover, Shiite militia includes few fundamentalists who would blindly obey Sistani. They are common guerrillas who only superficially subscribe to religion or ideology. They fight for the sake of killing. Their loyalty is with Sadr. Iran – al-Sadr’s sponsor – does not care about Iraqi Shiite bosses such as Sistani. Civil war in Iraq suits Iranian national interest: strong and hostile neighbor turns into protectorate.

Iran, not Sadr is the problem, but Sadr handsomely contributes to the situation. Oddly, the US loses its soldiers, kills Iraqis and allows still larger numbers to die in the conflict while al-Sadr, who orchestrates much of the violence, lives in safety. Why not assassinate him?

The White House PR people offended the common sense when they staged Robert Gates’ meeting with a dozen of handpicked soldiers who assured him that the army is on the right track.

adrian · 01-08-2007, 12:11 AM

All these off-topic posts are really, really annoying.

Admin, please go into the control panel and check the radio button that says "require e-mail verification", and also the button that says "require image verification". Please, please, please? It will keep irrelevant garbage like this out of the motorcycle forums.

zcat · 04-15-2007, 01:26 AM

This is exactly the type of topic I would expect in the "Independent Thinking" sub-forum, based on the description: "This forum is open for intellectual discussion, philosophy, and debate." Sounds like it's supposed to be the equivalent of sitting at the bar with a glass of beer talking about what's on your mind. Most topic-specific forums have such a sub-forum for this exact purpose.

z

CB750F · 04-15-2007, 06:13 AM

I'm gonna have to start drinking them. I quit when I was 21. It just wasn't fun anymore because it was legal. Now I'm all but 34 so i think it's time I start again.

Ever see the Queen of Jordan? Wow. Smokin'!

http://www.queenrania.jo/

Maico Shark · 04-15-2007, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zcat

This is exactly the type of topic I would expect in the "Independent Thinking" sub-forum, based on the description: "This forum is open for intellectual discussion, philosophy, and debate." Sounds like it's supposed to be the equivalent of sitting at the bar with a glass of beer talking about what's on your mind. Most topic-specific forums have such a sub-forum for this exact purpose.

z

Quite right zcat...Any man from any land, any game that he can name. I can dig what ozflower's saying but really think it's all a sham over there. The clerics call the tune in all the muslim nations. Five times a day the call to prayer comes from towers much like the morlocks of the book "Time Machine" These slaves march to their mosques to pray...oh not willy nilly but in strict unison like soldiers on the parade ground under the scrutiny of the imams. When they take to the streets in demonstrations it is never the result of honest outrage but the carefully arranged and staged performance ordered by the clerics and strictly enforced by their "religious police". Colonel Hunt called for "whacking" these clerics as soon as Saddam was defeated Fox News dropped him like a hot potato. Until the islamist leadership starts to die we can never win. The blood of our heroes is on Bush's hands. Even after weapons and fighters were discovered inside mosques they were put "off limits"...It would be nice if our fighters had some off limits places to rest and store their weapons.

For Adrians sake...And furthermore the islamists are against motorcycle shows and refuse to cruise

adrian · 04-15-2007, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maico Shark

the islamists are against motorcycle shows and refuse to cruise

This is an outrage. I am marching in protest! Wait, I am in Korea right now...

04-16-2007, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CB750F

Ever see the Queen of Jordan? Wow. Smokin'!

http://www.queenrania.jo/

Now that's a good candidate for a leather halter and assless chaps!

Maico Shark · 04-16-2007, 10:49 AM

Providing of course she has no buttcrack tattoo!

CB750F · 04-16-2007, 10:02 PM

On top of that she is RICH! Any chick is hot if she's insanely rich.

Capt. · 05-01-2007, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CB750F

On top of that she is RICH! Any chick is hot if she's insanely rich.

Ahhhgg.....sure looks purdy in the window but I don't think I could afford the high maintenance. However, I do think a test ride would be in order....whatya think??
Capt.

CB750F · 05-01-2007, 10:45 PM

Cause an international incident? I'm in.

05-02-2007, 12:57 PM

I think we just set the mideast peace process back 200 years.

Capt. · 05-02-2007, 05:40 PM

Wait a minute...just had a thought.....don't they slice off body parts over there for certain indiscretions???? Ahhh what da Hell count me in. They gotta catch me first!

01-07-2007, 09:43 PM	#1
OSfllwr Registered Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 2	Delusional cooperation The things in Iraq took yet another wrong turn when Bush forced Maliki to meet him in Jordan. The meeting did not help Republicans in the elections, but broke the Iraqi coalition. The faction of Shiite cleric al-Sadr walked out of the government coalition, as promised, because of the meeting. No one in Iraq has a slightest doubt that Maliki is an American quisling. That’s ok with the people. In Muslims countries, rulers are not expected to represent population; the US and the Qaeda each tries to change that. Muslims are very extroversive and value fac,ade and rituals. Maliki could be a puppet, but he should behave like a tiger – Iraqi tiger. At least, Maliki managed to skip social meeting with Bush and Jordanian King Abdullah (Olmert ignored Arab mentality and met Abdullah several times, a PR disaster). If that attention to rituals looks silly to rational Americans, it probably is. But that’s how it works in the region. To reach an agreement with Iraqis – rather than simply punish the Baathist state – the US negotiators would have to sit hours and days with various Iraqis, both bureaucrats and radicals, drinking super-sweet Iranian tea, chain-smoking on par with their opponents and talking, talking, and talking. That might or might not bring the desired results, but no other approach could deliver a stable, moderate, US-friendly Iraq. To please his American masters, Maliki brought together fictitious coalition. Its Shiite faction does not include al-Sadr’s group, the main Shiite organization. It includes only a minor Sunni party, also non-representative. The coalition is advertised as moderate, but listen to the names: Sunni Iraqi Islamic Party (sectarians), the Supreme Council for the Islamic Revolution (sic) in Iraq, and Patriotic Union of Kurdistan (separatist organization, as the name makes clear). The coalition is meant to squeeze Sadr out of politics. He would indeed go – into the urban battlefields. Sadr could show himself a good Muslim, promise to step down the fighting – and use the truce to train his forces. He needs time to grow the Mahdi gang into an army. Sistani’s approval won’t cement the coalition. He is merely a religious authority. Religious power in Islam is very dispersed because every cleric and theoretically every Muslim could pronounce fatwas. People go along with famous clerics insofar as they opportunistically serve the mob’s wishes. Sistani cannot afford to condemn fighting the Sunnis, thus his blessing of the coalition could only be half-hearted. Moreover, Shiite militia includes few fundamentalists who would blindly obey Sistani. They are common guerrillas who only superficially subscribe to religion or ideology. They fight for the sake of killing. Their loyalty is with Sadr. Iran – al-Sadr’s sponsor – does not care about Iraqi Shiite bosses such as Sistani. Civil war in Iraq suits Iranian national interest: strong and hostile neighbor turns into protectorate. Iran, not Sadr is the problem, but Sadr handsomely contributes to the situation. Oddly, the US loses its soldiers, kills Iraqis and allows still larger numbers to die in the conflict while al-Sadr, who orchestrates much of the violence, lives in safety. Why not assassinate him? The White House PR people offended the common sense when they staged Robert Gates’ meeting with a dozen of handpicked soldiers who assured him that the army is on the right track.

04-15-2007, 06:13 AM	#4
CB750F Shantytown Mayor Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Huntingdon Co, PA Posts: 4,721	I'm gonna have to start drinking them. I quit when I was 21. It just wasn't fun anymore because it was legal. Now I'm all but 34 so i think it's time I start again. Ever see the Queen of Jordan? Wow. Smokin'! http://www.queenrania.jo/ Last edited by CB750F; 04-15-2007 at 06:16 AM..

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01-08-2007, 12:11 AM	#2
adrian Spider Interwebby Thingy Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Arizona Posts: 586	All these off-topic posts are really, really annoying. Admin, please go into the control panel and check the radio button that says "require e-mail verification", and also the button that says "require image verification". Please, please, please? It will keep irrelevant garbage like this out of the motorcycle forums.

04-15-2007, 01:26 AM	#3
zcat Newbie Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 5	This is exactly the type of topic I would expect in the "Independent Thinking" sub-forum, based on the description: "This forum is open for intellectual discussion, philosophy, and debate." Sounds like it's supposed to be the equivalent of sitting at the bar with a glass of beer talking about what's on your mind. Most topic-specific forums have such a sub-forum for this exact purpose. z

04-16-2007, 10:49 AM	#8
Maico Shark Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Central Pa. Posts: 2,647	Providing of course she has no buttcrack tattoo!

04-16-2007, 10:02 PM	#9
CB750F Shantytown Mayor Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Huntingdon Co, PA Posts: 4,721	On top of that she is RICH! Any chick is hot if she's insanely rich.

05-01-2007, 10:45 PM	#11
CB750F Shantytown Mayor Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Huntingdon Co, PA Posts: 4,721	Cause an international incident? I'm in.

05-02-2007, 12:57 PM	#12
Uesque Guest Posts: n/a	I think we just set the mideast peace process back 200 years.

05-02-2007, 05:40 PM	#13
Capt. Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Pac. N.W. Posts: 381	Wait a minute...just had a thought.....don't they slice off body parts over there for certain indiscretions???? Ahhh what da Hell count me in. They gotta catch me first!