Do you warm up your bike?

[Eye_m_no_angel]

Originally Posted by OldGuy

I have an 82 450 Nighthawk, it does not like to run cold regardless of
weather. I've been told it's a characteristic of older Japanese bikes.
Could be true, who knows.

I think it's a characteristic of all old bikes, no matter who made them.

[R1200R]

Originally Posted by Eye_m_no_angel

With so much to choose from, I'll take up this one...<chuckle>

"This is because the cylinders and the pistons are made of different metals, and they don't fit properly at lower temperatures."

Your pistons and cylinders don't (shouldn't) ever contact each other anyway! Of course they don't fit properly.

The cylinder liner and piston rings are usualy made from a similar ferrous material, (steel, cast iron,) and they are what have contact. Plus, that's one of the things why there's a specified piston ring end gap: to allow for thermal expansion as the engine temperature changes.

to be fair to her though, they are made to operate at tighter tolerances than when cold as you yourself state.... this is my whole point of why demanding a lot of a cold engine is harmful, the rings aren't sealing,... it's reaching the normal operating temp insures that correct gap between seals and cylinders, anything less and you have rattle friction issues.. so it's always best to go easy.

[markk53]

Originally Posted by R1200R

so just to be clear, you don't see a problem with taking a cold engine up to redline? I know we normally don't ride like that, but God forbid you had to get max performance out of your bike for safety reasons (get out of the way of someone, etc..).. I guess I should have put that into my original post. I mean, I normally ride gently on the throttle until it warms up myself, but you never know when you'll need that redline power.

This is the whole misleading part in these discussions...

The instant someone says they have no problem with riding off within seconds after starting the bike some associate that with redlining an engine. The facts are there is adequate clearance in an engine to run fine under NORMAL midrange rpm, not race rpm. The problem is when an engine is run hard within seconds, the piston expands quicker than the cylinder. This IS NOT a problem when the engine is simply ridden away in a sensible fashion that is appropriate for legal street riding... aka NOT REDLINE!

That said, I will pull away within a few seconds after starting. My Kawasaki will idle at 5000 rpm free rev, when I ride away I actually am not adding any throttle for the most part and actually having to brake a bit against the engine, which is no mechanical issue since it really isn't generating excess heat and there is plenty adequate oiling. And no, I don't redline it!

It's like someone saying they like a glass of wine with dinner and then being asked if they approve of chugging a bottle of Jack Daniels daily.

[primalmu]

I find that after I adjusted the AF screws on my carbs my B12 requires minimal, if any, choke when its warm outside (80+). Before I messed with the AF screws it would absolutely require full choke to start. When I drop in a Holeshot jet kit this should improve even more (not going to happen any time soon, though).

[markk53]

Originally Posted by R1200R

to be fair to her though, they are made to operate at tighter tolerances than when cold as you yourself state.... this is my whole point of why demanding a lot of a cold engine is harmful, the rings aren't sealing,... it's reaching the normal operating temp insures that correct gap between seals and cylinders, anything less and you have rattle friction issues.. so it's always best to go easy.

Again, like everyone who doesn't sit and let a bike warm up is racing off like going onto the banking at Daytona.

By the way, the rings DO seal, if they don't you'd have oil smoke coming out of your engine at idle and when riding away until it is fully warmed up. The rings have their own spring tension against the cylinder walls along with the exhaust pressure behind the ring pressing it out against the cylinder. Yes, exhaust pressure, there is a bit of clearance in the rings top to bottom and the cylinder pressure pushes the ring down, then gets behind it in the groove and pushes it out. So the rings are sealing, with the only real leakage being that the roughly .020" ring gap may allow a bit more blow by until they warm up and that gap drops a bit.

Again the concern with running hard too soon is purely sticking a piston when the aluminum, which does have a higher rate of thermal expansion than steel, swells too rapidly and siezes in the cylinder. This is even a bigger risk on two strokes since they fire every time around. Thus, warm up on two strokes is a shade more critical, but again, mainly in racing and hard riding that off roading can be.

By the way, your rattle friction is a term I never heard in any of my mechanical, physics, or technology classes. I think you might be talking about piston rattle, that occurs when the clearances are at their largest. There really isn't any problem with four stroke piston rattle, usually an audible clicking as the piston rocks when going over TDC. Two strokes can have real issues though if the intake skirt catches the edge of the intake. That rattle will usually persist and slowly disappear as the cylinder and piston reach full operating temperatures - remember the aluminum expands more than the steel? The clearance between piston and cylinder get smaller than the cold spec and the rocking is nearly non-existant and thus quieter.

I do know this from both personal and dealership experience. My KLX has piston click when cold and I was around the dealership when there were piston clicking complaints with early Vulcan 1500s. I got one of the warranty take out pistons. You see, there was no problem with the engine from a mechanical point of view, only from the owner not liking the clicking noise. The solution was to use a slightly offset wrist pin to minimize clicking, no clearance changes. Same thing happened back around 1973 with the Z1 Kaw too, same solution.

Virtually all manufacturers and knowlegeable mechanics will tell you if the engine will run without stalling the bike can be ridden away in a reasonable fashion. Again that would be pretty much a street legal fashion, light acceleration and legal speeds. The actual load is so light when riding away in a sensible normal fashion that it is no worse on the engine wear.

[Eye_m_no_angel]

Well, Mark pretty much nailed it to the wall.

Much better written then I could have done it, and a lot faster too.

[markk53]

Originally Posted by OldGuy

I have an 82 450 Nighthawk, it does not like to run cold regardless of
weather. I've been told it's a characteristic of older Japanese bikes.
Could be true, who knows.

Yours is the exception to the rule: If you can ride off without stalling while on choke the bike is good to go.

It isn't the engine heat or oil, it is the jetting. Bikes from the mid 70s on using some of the older established engines of the time were built to run with certain jetting, but the EPA dictates less emissions, which meant leaner jetting. Thus your bike will stumble since your 82 engine was a 1978 design that had been leaned down to meet EPA specs. Same was true with a lot of the engines of the time. Keeping the choke on for a long time. The newer design 83-86 Nighthawk 550/650/700S would fire up and be off choke within about 15-30 seconds depending on ambient temperature.

So it is the jetting which is lean. Possibly if you could find a Nighthawk forum you could find out if the jetting could be richened up to work better when cold and maybe run a bit stronger too. It would be a larger pilot jet and adjusting the idle mix screws (which are capped off to keep from being adjusted, but the caps can be removed - if you don't live in some E-check area).

Good bike though. I rode one as a demo when I started selling in the spring of 83. A great full size bike with decent power.

[Biker Dash]

Originally Posted by markk53

Virtually all manufacturers and knowlegeable mechanics will tell you if the engine will run without stalling the bike can be ridden away in a reasonable fashion. Again that would be pretty much a street legal fashion, light acceleration and legal speeds. The actual load is so light when riding away in a sensible normal fashion that it is no worse on the engine wear.

Best answer right there. You dont need to warm up the engine before riding. If you choose to do so, thats fine though.

[R1200R]

Originally Posted by markk53

This is the whole misleading part in these discussions...

the thing is, do you KNOW for certain you won't have to tap the power from your bike as you're pulling away from that parking lot, your driveway, or wherever it happened to be sitting last? Sure it's not likely that you will, but what if? Moreover, this doesn't have to go to the extreme... My bike develops a rather flat power/torque curve, I am taxing my engine at 4500 rpm in some cases, much less 8500... I just don't see the harm in warming up for 45sec to a minute. To turn it around on you, some here are trying to paint this as a "idle until I reach normal operating temps" and that was never my suggestion..

As to the rattle, yes, I was getting to piston rattle which normally goes away at operating temps if I'm now wrong, am I?

And since you're clearly an expert in this field, I'd love to ask you this... does it do any harm to warm up the engine for up to one minute, allowing the oil pressure to stabilize? I know on my bike, which is a new 2012, the oil sump has a lens where I can watch the oil level drop after a cold start and it normally takes up to 30 seconds just for that to occur.. the sump being emptied into the engine so to say..

[DachshundUberAlles]

Just out of curiosity:

Do any of the "warm up" proponents apply the same to all their internal combustion engine equipped possessions? Your auto? Lawnmower? Trimmer? Blower? Operating under the theory that an engine is an engine is an engine, how long do you allow the lawn equipment to warm up before you begin the chore?

[R1200R]

Originally Posted by DachshundUberAlles

Just out of curiosity:

Do any of the "warm up" proponents apply the same to all their internal combustion engine equipped possessions? Your auto? Lawnmower? Trimmer? Blower? Operating under the theory that an engine is an engine is an engine, how long do you allow the lawn equipment to warm up before you begin the chore?

Honda Mower, Chevy Duramax, BMW X5 yes...
Chevy Volt, no

[murphyshuman]

Mark is correct, on all points, OP, stop trying the "what if" scenarios, you can what if anything to death. What if the ice caps melt while I'm o a ride, what if it snows three feet in july in the desert and I'm on racing slicks.
If you want to warm up your bike fine, let it go dude.

[R1200R]

Originally Posted by murphyshuman

Mark is correct, on all points, OP, stop trying the "what if" scenarios, you can what if anything to death. What if the ice caps melt while I'm o a ride, what if it snows three feet in july in the desert and I'm on racing slicks.
If you want to warm up your bike fine, let it go dude.

don't like where I"m going with the topic, hit the unsubscribe... I'm convinced that a lot of the anti-warm up "facts" are due to all the pressures from environmental groups, and since the manufacturers just want to sell you that next vehicle, what do they care if you only get 100,000 miles out it..

and there are no what ifs'... in my "OP" I stated that I was a proponent of a short warm up, not a full blown "reach operating temp" warmup which many like you seem to think I'm pushing..

[Dodsfall]

I don't think anyone has posted that it is "bad" to warm up the engine for a short while. I can't think of any reason where it would hurt anything at all.

Some motorcycles simply don't require it.

As far as a scenario where it is required to red line the engine hard to avoid an accident, I've never encountered having to do that in 30 years of riding on the street. Sure, there are plenty of times where a rider has to speed up to get out of the way, but avoiding a collision usually happens in a time window of maybe a second or two at the longest. If it takes a full-throttle 1/4 mile drag race to avoid an accident, you're doing something wrong.

[R1200R]

not drag racing, just acceleration to road speeds (maybe 45mph) puts a lot of load on a cold engine.. 1 minute is a good number... much longer is diminishing returns and possibly harmful.

True story, I went to the dealer with a friend looking at a Moto Guzzi and they started the bike... my friend went to rev it and the salesman got all over him for it... said to him "If this were your bike, would you rev it while it was cold?"
How is that difference than start and go?

You Tube

You Tube

[Bede5man]

Sanford, my Toyota pickup does that too...the first gear shifting can be a little stiff when it's cold.

It's the synchromesh rings' friction...once the oil warms up it synchs better/quicker. Nothing wrong with yer tranny.

Some designs are just prone to have it detectable.

[Hawkeye]

Originally Posted by Christine

1. The engine gets damaged when it runs at a temperature lower than normal operating temperature. This is because the cylinders and the pistons are made of different metals, and they don't fit properly at lower temperatures.
2. An engine produces heat only when it produces labor.
3. An idling engine does not produce labor

hence, it's bad for your bike to let it "warm up". It's best to ride off immediately, at low rpm and moderate speed. Letting your bike warm up actually damages the engine.

Haha, I love it when people spout off about stuff they don't know the answer to.

I am pretty sure the engineers at Yamaha know a little more than you do. Check out sections 5 page 2. First thing on the page. http://www.yamaha-motor.com/assets/s...-17-46_819.pdf

Originally Posted by Owners Manual

For maximum engine life, always warm up the engine before starting off.

[R1200R]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

Haha, I love it when people spout off about stuff they don't know the answer to.

I am pretty sure the engineers at Yamaha know a little more than you do. Check out sections 5 page 2. First thing on the page. http://www.yamaha-motor.com/assets/s...-17-46_819.pdf

great find...

Yet we're all supposed to believe now that magically engines 5 years later don't need any kind of warmup.. it's just like I said above, this is as a result of pressure from environmental concerns and nothing to do with science.. All vehicle manuals now leave that out, when they used to include it.

Like the guy above said, do what you want, but I'm just trying to provide a forum for discussion on a topic that while important, is rarely discussed.

[Biker Dash]

It's been shown that the difference in wear between letting her warm up, and starting the bike and riding immediately normally is so minor when it comes to wear on the engies, it really doesn't matter for all practical purposes.

[ReconLdr]

My Buell doesn't like to be cold. I use full choke for 15-60 seconds depending on ambient temperature. If the temp is above 60 take the choke off and ride, if below, half choke for 30 seconds before riding.

"Warming up an engine" went away with the introduction of multi-weight oils. Back in the day cars/trucks/bikes would use single weight oils and in the winter time, it would take a few minutes to get 40w oil moving properly. It was then recommended to let an engine warm up before driving. With modern oils the its lubrication properties are engineered for best effects over a wider temperature range. Example:

I use Mobil 1 V-Twin (synthetic) 20w - 50 for my engine and primary in my Buell. Rather than getting into a length post about fluid dynamics and viscosity, I'll explain it in simple terms. When my engine/oil is cold, it flows and lubricates like SAE 20. When my engine gets up to operating temperature it flows and lubricates like SAE 50. This allows oil to flow to all the pieces and parts faster to provide lubrication and cooling on start up.

Since very few people and no shop I've heard of uses straight weight oil anymore, it's a safe bet that you (or your shop) use the appropriate oil for your bike. If you agree that you or your shop used the right oil at the last service, your oil pump will get the oil where it needs to be by the time the engine actually starts.

If you have a carb, it may be wise (it is for me) to warm up the bike a little so it'll idle better when you come to a stop. Other than drivability, there is no need to "warm up" an engine.

[sanford]

Originally Posted by Bede5man

Sanford, my Toyota pickup does that too...the first gear shifting can be a little stiff when it's cold.

It's the synchromesh rings' friction...once the oil warms up it synchs better/quicker. Nothing wrong with yer tranny.

Some designs are just prone to have it detectable.

Good to know, thanks

[Rebel53]

I let it run for about a minute, to get oil flowing into the upper cylinders and the heads. I'd rather do that than risk having oil starvation, even for only a moment.

[Gereke]

BMW Dude:

If following a warm up routine on your flawlessly engineered Bavarian Motor Works Motorrad helps you sleep better at night, more power to you. Don't let us nay-sayers harsh your warm up mellow. We want you to go to Starbucks feeling happy. So grab your Touratech catalog for some light farkle shopping, and sip on a Venti Mocha knowing you're keeping your engine in top shape. Your vigilance will ensure 125,000 trouble free miles instead of only 124,500.

[Biker Dash]

Originally Posted by Gereke

BMW Dude:

If following a warm up routine on your flawlessly engineered Bavarian Motor Works Motorrad helps you sleep better at night, more power to you. Don't let us nay-sayers harsh your warm up mellow. We want you to go to Starbucks feeling happy. So grab your Touratech catalog for some light farkle shopping, and sip on a Venti Mocha knowing you're keeping your engine in top shape. Your vigilance will ensure 125,000 trouble free miles instead of only 124,500.

lol PRICELESS!

[Landarchstud]

I rev it a couple times with the choke on and then take off. If you sit their and idle you can actually gum up your carburetors if you're using ethanol gas.

[Gremson]

I always let my Honda warm up.
She really gets pissed if I don't, absolutely no get up and go. It doesn't feel safe to head out on the roads when I can't roll on the throttle and have the bike quickly respond.
I usually just start it up, have a smoke, push in the choke, and take flight!

[markk53]

Originally Posted by R1200R

the thing is, do you KNOW for certain you won't have to tap the power from your bike as you're pulling away from that parking lot, your driveway, or wherever it happened to be sitting last? Sure it's not likely that you will, but what if? Moreover, this doesn't have to go to the extreme... My bike develops a rather flat power/torque curve, I am taxing my engine at 4500 rpm in some cases, much less 8500... I just don't see the harm in warming up for 45sec to a minute. To turn it around on you, some here are trying to paint this as a "idle until I reach normal operating temps" and that was never my suggestion..

As to the rattle, yes, I was getting to piston rattle which normally goes away at operating temps if I'm now wrong, am I?

And since you're clearly an expert in this field, I'd love to ask you this... does it do any harm to warm up the engine for up to one minute, allowing the oil pressure to stabilize? I know on my bike, which is a new 2012, the oil sump has a lens where I can watch the oil level drop after a cold start and it normally takes up to 30 seconds just for that to occur.. the sump being emptied into the engine so to say..

First off, clearly you posted this to try to point out how wrong we all are if we don't do what you do.

Second, I think I made it clear that one is moving away sensibly. That means entering traffic and going down the road sensibly. Now if a full redline is necessary to save one's butt I think someone isn't paying attention and being sensible.

Third, I never said anything about warming up a bit except maybe to say that excessively long warm up will turn pipes blue and that the cooling air over the exhaust and front of the head is important on air cooled bikes. A minute or two will no way hurt anything, it's the ten to twenty minute idling that does the heat thing. I've seen double wall chrome pipes on OEM bikes blued from heat - that is just plain hard on an air cooled bike in the exhaust area since the heat is concentrating there and no cooling air is flowing.

But your whole gist was to needle anyone who didn't do what you do. I will fire my bike up and be rolling in 10-30 seconds in most cases and operating usually at maybe half the rpm range, neither lugging at low rpm nor loading the engine with hard acceleration. I more or less just let the engine work as if it was sitting and warming up - remember I said I have Kawasakis that tend to rev from 3000-5000 rpm because they don't use a choke, they use an enrichening circuit which is not really designed for partial levels like a proper choke found on Hondas. I also worked in a motorcycle dealership and we were over all this in conversations with the various service reps. Again, if the bike can be easily ridden away without stalling, it is okay to ride them off - SENSIBLY, LEGALLY.

Oh, and since you have deemed me an expert, that oil isn't in passages, it is partially filling the valve cover/head areas and all over inside the cases as it works to flow back - by gravity through passages, not under pressure - to the sump. The vital engine parts are oiled within less than a second after the oil pump starts to spin - notice I did not say the bike starts up, it seems the pump spins the instant the crank turns, not when the engine first fires (but I am sure you know that). So chances are before you are off the button there is oil pressure and oil through out the engine.

I can also tell you that piston rattle is simply the rocking of the piston in the bore. The extra clearance needed to allow for thermal expansion. I don't know if you realize it, but the usual clearance on the skirt of a piston of that size is LESS than .005". I think my KLX 650 with a 102mm bore was bored at .003" skirt clearance. Most two strokes are considered worn out and need bored if they have .007" clearance. I'm not sure what piston ring end gaps usually are, but I know my old Bultaco was considered good at .017"

If piston rocking was any critical issue, BMW would deal with it. As I said, my KLX does the same thing as did the big Vulcans. Kawasaki didn't see any issue with that either.

I won't post topics to bait others then tell them they're wrong in what they do.

[markk53]

Originally Posted by Rebel53

I let it run for about a minute, to get oil flowing into the upper cylinders and the heads. I'd rather do that than risk having oil starvation, even for only a moment.

Let it run if it makes you feel more secure. The oil has reached the head before the engine has even fired. Not to mention that oil remains behind in all the cam journal plain bearing areas. It would take years for the oil to actually dry out. By the way, the loading on the cams is pretty much the same whether riding normally or sitting there idling. The spring pressure is the same every rotation, there are just more rotations per minute. So if it is an oil flow issue, simply sitting there idling won't do anything for the head.

The real concern is being able to ride off without the bike stumbling on throttle. A lot of the 70s and 80s bikes that used 70s based engines run extremely lean and can not be ridden off immediately. They need a bit of warm up. My 86 Honda 700S was a modern design at the time and could be ridden off virtually instantly, going off choke in less than a quarter mile. In winter it might need half choke for a bit, then go off.

It's all in safe ridability.

[ken45]

Originally Posted by R1200R

so just to be clear, you don't see a problem with taking a cold engine up to redline?

I don't take any engine up to redline and cannot imagine any sudden need to do so.

If you think you are going to need to suddenly hit redline, perhaps you need to reexamine your riding technique.

Everything I've read about cars says that extra idling is bad on them. Start up and go gently even in cold weather. I assume that's probably the best approach for a bike too.

Ken

[curtis41]

On the Thunderbird 1600, I start up the engine and let it idle while I put on my helmet, jacket and gloves. Then, I keep it under 3,000 rpm for the first few miles. In winter, I give it a good 5-10 minute warm-up before taking off. Some riders just get on and go, and take it easy until the oil warms up and the engine gets up to good operating temperature. My sense is it matters more in winter, where the engine might not get as good lubrication, and give it a while to warm up.

[Biker Dash]

Originally Posted by ken45

I don't take any engine up to redline and cannot imagine any sudden need to do so.

If you think you are going to need to suddenly hit redline, perhaps you need to reexamine your riding technique.

Everything I've read about cars says that extra idling is bad on them. Start up and go gently even in cold weather. I assume that's probably the best approach for a bike too.

Ken

Sometimes, that need is more of a desire. And in moderation, there is no harm (unless there is something wrong with the engine, or you did something not to bright, like turning the redline too high. (potential risk with a Dyna 3000 in a Shadow 750) There havs never been a time when I needed to do so, but there are times when I want to, and can do so safely.

As for extra idling, on a lot of engines, it does no real harm, as long as the engine is maintained. As Mark said, on air cooled engines, they do rely on airflow to cool it. I can idle my Shadow all day, and at the most, I will just discolor my pipes, burn extra gas, and possibly slowly drain my battery. (due to stator putting out less juice than is drawn by lights, ignition, and fuel pump.)

[R1200R]

Originally Posted by markk53

First off, clearly you posted this to try to point out how wrong we all are if we don't do what you do.

Second, I think I made it clear that one is moving away sensibly. That means entering traffic and going down the road sensibly. Now if a full redline is necessary to save one's butt I think someone isn't paying attention and being sensible.

Third, I never said anything about warming up a bit except maybe to say that excessively long warm up will turn pipes blue and that the cooling air over the exhaust and front of the head is important on air cooled bikes. A minute or two will no way hurt anything, it's the ten to twenty minute idling that does the heat thing. I've seen double wall chrome pipes on OEM bikes blued from heat - that is just plain hard on an air cooled bike in the exhaust area since the heat is concentrating there and no cooling air is flowing.

But your whole gist was to needle anyone who didn't do what you do. I will fire my bike up and be rolling in 10-30 seconds in most cases and operating usually at maybe half the rpm range, neither lugging at low rpm nor loading the engine with hard acceleration. I more or less just let the engine work as if it was sitting and warming up - remember I said I have Kawasakis that tend to rev from 3000-5000 rpm because they don't use a choke, they use an enrichening circuit which is not really designed for partial levels like a proper choke found on Hondas. I also worked in a motorcycle dealership and we were over all this in conversations with the various service reps. Again, if the bike can be easily ridden away without stalling, it is okay to ride them off - SENSIBLY, LEGALLY.

Oh, and since you have deemed me an expert, that oil isn't in passages, it is partially filling the valve cover/head areas and all over inside the cases as it works to flow back - by gravity through passages, not under pressure - to the sump. The vital engine parts are oiled within less than a second after the oil pump starts to spin - notice I did not say the bike starts up, it seems the pump spins the instant the crank turns, not when the engine first fires (but I am sure you know that). So chances are before you are off the button there is oil pressure and oil through out the engine.

I can also tell you that piston rattle is simply the rocking of the piston in the bore. The extra clearance needed to allow for thermal expansion. I don't know if you realize it, but the usual clearance on the skirt of a piston of that size is LESS than .005". I think my KLX 650 with a 102mm bore was bored at .003" skirt clearance. Most two strokes are considered worn out and need bored if they have .007" clearance. I'm not sure what piston ring end gaps usually are, but I know my old Bultaco was considered good at .017"

If piston rocking was any critical issue, BMW would deal with it. As I said, my KLX does the same thing as did the big Vulcans. Kawasaki didn't see any issue with that either.

I won't post topics to bait others then tell them they're wrong in what they do.

thanks for the informative post and engaging in the discussion.... even with the dig at me in the end, it was helpful to me to read, and I expect for others as well.

[ralphlong]

If you want to warm it up, do so. You ain't hurtn nutt'n and you may be helping, and this gives you an opportunity to get your head into the ride.

The benefits, unless it is really cold, and you have real thick oil, are minimal.

It also gives you and opportunity to either impress or piss off the neighbors, depending on the pipes on your bike and your mood.

Ralph.

[Eye_m_no_angel]

"thanks for the informative post and engaging in the discussion.... even with the dig at me in the end, it was helpful to me to read, and I expect for others as well."

Did any of this change anyone's warm-up procedures?

[sanford]

not changed my mind for my bike..if I don't warm up runs rough and even stops..for a car if time will warm up but not a concearn runs like a top all the time, knock on wood (my head)


I did change the way I park a bike if that counts

[Biker Dash]

Originally Posted by Eye_m_no_angel

"thanks for the informative post and engaging in the discussion.... even with the dig at me in the end, it was helpful to me to read, and I expect for others as well."

Did any of this change anyone's warm-up procedures?

nope

[DuckyTopTN]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

My engine has a heat sensor. I wait till it does not say LOW and it has a temperature, usually around 120-160 degrees before riding.

Same here

[Hawkeye]

Originally Posted by Gereke

BMW Dude:

If following a warm up routine on your flawlessly engineered Bavarian Motor Works Motorrad helps you sleep better at night, more power to you. Don't let us nay-sayers harsh your warm up mellow. We want you to go to Starbucks feeling happy. So grab your Touratech catalog for some light farkle shopping, and sip on a Venti Mocha knowing you're keeping your engine in top shape. Your vigilance will ensure 125,000 trouble free miles instead of only 124,500.

This post just screams jealousy. Good work Geeke.

Plus, if you had ever owned a BMW you would know there is no such thing as 100,000 trouble free miles ... awesome has a price.

[murphyshuman]

Originally Posted by murphyshuman

I generally talk sweet to it, massage it in the right places and give a glass of wine before a ride, there, all warmed up!

Nope, no change, I still do this......

[Gereke]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

This post just screams jealousy. Good work Geeke.

Plus, if you had ever owned a BMW you would know there is no such thing as 100,000 trouble free miles ... awesome has a price.

I'll give you two responses:

First response covers you ribbing me over the ribbing I was giving the OP:

"Well played sir! Well played!"

Second response covers the possibility that you are sensitive to the BMW Starbucks stereotype, and as such weren't giving me a ribbing:

"I was just playing with the guy! Lighten up, Francis"

(I'd own a BMW in a heartbeat. Particularly a GS or a GSA)