Lots of questions, would love some help

[Niconi]

Hey folks, i'm brand new here, 19 years old, and really wanting to get a motorcycle. I know there are probably other threads that address some of my questions, but I feel like motorcycles are personal, and I kind of wanted some personal input.

Anyways, obviously my parents are against me getting one, which doesn't bother me much because I can buy one soon without help from them. But, they have filled my head with gruesome stories of motorcycle crashes. When I get out of college in 3 years I want to join the military, so I really don't want to risk TOO much right now, because I don't want to become ineligible for the military. Anyways, with proper gear/safety, how likely is a crash? And in a crash, does anyone have any input or statistics as to how often there is permanent damage?

Also, I've heard great things about Cyclesport gear, but there seems to be LOTS of debate on leather vs kevlar. Does anyone have any opinions on which is better? Also, if anyone could point me in the direction of the highest rated safety gear currently on the market, I'd be much obliged.

Thirdly, If I take more than one MSF course before I buy a bike, then buy a "beginner" bike, and spend 20+ hours practicing in a parking lot before I even try the streets, will I be in pretty good shape?

I apologize for my first post on the forum being so massive, but I have a lot of questions! I really want a motorcycle, but so many people seem to act like everyone who owns one stands a good chance of losing limbs or suffering brain damage or dying. Hopefully some of you can clear up some of my confusion. Thanks!
Nick

[Dodsfall]

Studies show that statistically, you are about 17 times more likely to be involved in an accident with serious injuries than when driving an automobile.

Those are the numbers for the entire pool of riders which of course are impossible to translate to what will happen to an individual. There are simply too many factors involved.

The safest gear would be a full track suit like professional racers wear, along with a quality helmet, boots, and gloves. It's not always feasible to ride around in a racing suit, but common sense equipment will reduce the chance of head injury or skin abrasion.

A single MSF course should give most riders a decent start, as long as they pass and understand the material. I don't see the logic in taking more than one back-to-back unless the student really struggled with the material and barely managed the course.

As far as how many hours of practice is needed, I can't help you there. People get the hang of riding at different rates and learn at different speeds. Even after decades of riding, there is more to learn for most people.

[Blademaker]

As a new rider myself I can speak highly of the MSF course. Even after the course though you won't be ready to head down the interstate at 70 MPH. What they teach you is the basics, and to build on that.

I don't mean offense, but I don't know if I could recommend a motorcycle for a 19 year old. I don't know about you, but when I was 19 I thought I was 10' tall and immortal. 20 years and some close calls have taught me different. Maybe your different, I was hard headed and at the time pretty high strung and thought I knew everything.

That said I know of a rider that wrecked his bike twice in under six months, first time wasn't bad, second time turned him into hamburger, but no broken bones. Both times he would have walked away with bruises only if, he'd been sober, doing the speed limit, and wearing something other than shorts and a tank top. He was in his early 40's at the time, and a first time rider.

From talking with experienced riders, riding is like life, it's a journey, not a destination, you never master it, there's always something more to learn. There is a wealth of information on this site, and people who will help.

[Niconi]

Thanks for the quick reply, and advice, both of you!

Originally Posted by Blademaker

I don't mean offense, but I don't know if I could recommend a motorcycle for a 19 year old. I don't know about you, but when I was 19 I thought I was 10' tall and immortal. 20 years and some close calls have taught me different. Maybe your different, I was hard headed and at the time pretty high strung and thought I knew everything.

This is something I do really take into consideration. I tend to be very level-headed, and I know and understand i'm FAR from immortal. I also understand, however, that 19 year olds by default are not as mature as say a 30 year old. Waiting to ride may be the best course of action, but at the same time, if I were to die in the military, then I would die without experiencing something I really want to experience.

It's a tough call for me haha, which is why i'm really looking at both sides with a scrutinizing eye. Thanks again for the advice.

[Blademaker]

That's the best thing you can do, and I've seen some pretty mature 19 year olds and some pretty immature 30 year olds, so age alone isn't a determining factor. Best thing to do is what your doing, and make an informed decision.

My father used to ride before mother made him give it up and his advice was "don't get cocky". I couldn't agree more.

Good luck and be safe.

[distantThunder]

OK ... first off - riding a motorcycle is inherently dangerous.
It just is. So you need to decide if you accept this - or not.

Of course ... joining the military is also inherently dangerous.
I'm not putting the military down in any way.
Just pointing out that you are choosing risky lifestyles :-)

I've been doing risky things my whole life.
By and large I've lived thru all of them, with only a few injuries.
The most important things are to get the right training, and to learn from experienced people.
Then keep your head together.
That is your BEST chance to stay in one piece.

And notice that the advice above applies to BOTH riding motorcyles and doing military jobs :-)

cheers,
dT

[goalie]

Niconi:
1. Highly recommend the MSF course. It will probably have you feeling much more comfortable about riding.
2. There's a place for leather and for kevlar. Speaking of jackets ... Leather with a armor is normally the best all around protection to wear. However, when the weather gets really hot, mesh with armor and kevlar is far more comfortable. As far as pants, I have heard stories of riders whose denim pants have held up and prevented abrasion. But if you want to be certain, you'll need to wear either leather or kevlar.
3. If you do not have the luxury of a friend with lots of experience to follow, you need to take EVERY opportunity to ride the back roads and less busy roads that you can. We all learn at different rates, but nothing breeds comfort like experience.
Good luck.

[mikevillena]

Originally Posted by Niconi

Hey folks, i'm brand new here, 19 years old, and really wanting to get a motorcycle. I know there are probably other threads that address some of my questions, but I feel like motorcycles are personal, and I kind of wanted some personal input.

Anyways, obviously my parents are against me getting one, which doesn't bother me much because I can buy one soon without help from them. But, they have filled my head with gruesome stories of motorcycle crashes. When I get out of college in 3 years I want to join the military, so I really don't want to risk TOO much right now, because I don't want to become ineligible for the military. Anyways, with proper gear/safety, how likely is a crash? And in a crash, does anyone have any input or statistics as to how often there is permanent damage?

Also, I've heard great things about Cyclesport gear, but there seems to be LOTS of debate on leather vs kevlar. Does anyone have any opinions on which is better? Also, if anyone could point me in the direction of the highest rated safety gear currently on the market, I'd be much obliged.

Thirdly, If I take more than one MSF course before I buy a bike, then buy a "beginner" bike, and spend 20+ hours practicing in a parking lot before I even try the streets, will I be in pretty good shape?

I apologize for my first post on the forum being so massive, but I have a lot of questions! I really want a motorcycle, but so many people seem to act like everyone who owns one stands a good chance of losing limbs or suffering brain damage or dying. Hopefully some of you can clear up some of my confusion. Thanks!
Nick

First of all, thank you ahead of time for your future intent to serve the country (and to those who have served and are currently serving). Yes, riding a motorcycle is a risky activity. This is reality. But with proper training, proper gear, proper motorcycle and the correct attitude, you CAN mitigate or reduce those risks. Sign up for the MSF BRC before you do anything. Heed the advice of the many experienced members here (and elsewhere) if and when you do go shopping for a motorcycle. As to gear, it won't prevent an accident. However, wearing proper gear can INCREASE THE ODDS of you surviving or minimizing your injuries IN CASE OF AN ACCIDENT. Having the proper training and the CORRECT ATTITUDE will also help you to AVOID an accident to begin with. As to gear, it has also been debated here and on other forums. My advice is to look at folks who regularly take a tumble on their motorcycles. Namely, folks who race motorcycles not on the street but on the track. Take a look at what they are wearing. A good and properly fitting helmet is a must. As to clothing, leather gives you the best abrasion protection. It will survive a long slide on the asphalt and will resist tearing far better than most fabrics. IT can get expensive and hot but you can get perforated leather which helps with cooling. A spine guard and additional armour built into the clothing is a plus. Do not forget to protect your lower extremities as well (your butt, legs and feet). Good leather pants with armour and a good pair of motorcycling specific boots. Denim pants will shred very easily. Work boots won't cut it. See my earlier post: http://www.motorcycleforum.com/showthread.php?t=113786
In short, buy the best gear that you can afford and WEAR IT. A grand worth of gear will not do much good if it's hanging in the closet.

As to correct attitude, (and I know some people will disagree with me) it has nothing to do with respect or fear. Riding a motorcycle is not black magic or voodoo. It is a PHYSICAL exercise and is governed by PHYSICS. The sooner you understand that the better off you are. Before you start riding, do some reading to understand what's behind the physics and dynamics of riding a motorcycle. Things such as why you have to countersteer above a ceratin speed in order to turn. Or why as a beginner, you shouldn't brake when you are leaned over. There are many good books out there worth reading. Instead of superstition, you will need to and must also rely on physical skills and the knowledge that you will acquire as you progress. Start off with the MSF BRC. (I believe that you will need to pass the BRC if you intend to ride a motorcycle on base) Then take those very basic skills that they teach you and build on them. The skills come in part from muscle memory (things that you do instinctively without having to think about it) which you acquire from constant training such as parking lot exercises or running the actual MSF course when it's open to the public. After the BRC, take the next searies of courses such as the Intermediate and the Advanced. Some riders (both beginners and experienced) will also sign up for a track day where they can explore their motorcycle at or near the limit in a safer and controlled environment. BTW, as a beginner, you won't even know where your limits are. That's why it's advisable to go slowly and to learn on a smaller, less powerful bike. LEAVE YOUR EGO AT THE DOOR. Another important aspect of attitude is to fully understand road and traffic conditions and adjust your riding accordingly. Strive to acquire the valuable skill of "situational awareness" early on. There is so much more that you will need to understand. I know that it's a lot but it is worth the trouble if you wish to enjoy a long and enjoyable riding career. Best of luck and don't be afraid to ask questions

[Road Warrior]

Originally Posted by mikevillena

First of all, thank you ahead of time for your future intent to serve the country (and to those who have served and are currently serving). Yes, riding a motorcycle is a risky activity. This is reality. But with proper training, proper gear, proper motorcycle and the correct attitude, you CAN mitigate or reduce those risks. Sign up for the MSF BRC before you do anything. Heed the advice of the many experienced members here (and elsewhere) if and when you do go shopping for a motorcycle. As to gear, it won't prevent an accident. However, wearing proper gear can INCREASE THE ODDS of you surviving or minimizing your injuries IN CASE OF AN ACCIDENT. Having the proper training and the CORRECT ATTITUDE will also help you to AVOID an accident to begin with. As to gear, it has also been debated here and on other forums. My advice is to look at folks who regularly take a tumble on their motorcycles. Namely, folks who race motorcycles not on the street but on the track. Take a look at what they are wearing. A good and properly fitting helmet is a must. As to clothing, leather gives you the best abrasion protection. It will survive a long slide on the asphalt and will resist tearing far better than most fabrics. IT can get expensive and hot but you can get perforated leather which helps with cooling. A spine guard and additional armour built into the clothing is a plus. Do not forget to protect your lower extremities as well (your butt, legs and feet). Good leather pants with armour and a good pair of motorcycling specific boots. Denim pants will shred very easily. Work boots won't cut it. See my earlier post: http://www.motorcycleforum.com/showthread.php?t=113786
In short, buy the best gear that you can afford and WEAR IT. A grand worth of gear will not do much good if it's hanging in the closet.

As to correct attitude, (and I know some people will disagree with me) it has nothing to do with respect or fear. Riding a motorcycle is not black magic or voodoo. It is a PHYSICAL exercise and is governed by PHYSICS. The sooner you understand that the better off you are. Before you start riding, do some reading to understand what's behind the physics and dynamics of riding a motorcycle. Things such as why you have to countersteer above a ceratin speed in order to turn. Or why as a beginner, you shouldn't brake when you are leaned over. There are many good books out there worth reading. Instead of superstition, you will need to and must also rely on physical skills and the knowledge that you will acquire as you progress. Start off with the MSF BRC. (I believe that you will need to pass the BRC if you intend to ride a motorcycle on base) Then take those very basic skills that they teach you and build on them. The skills come in part from muscle memory (things that you do instinctively without having to think about it) which you acquire from constant training such as parking lot exercises or running the actual MSF course when it's open to the public. After the BRC, take the next searies of courses such as the Intermediate and the Advanced. Some riders (both beginners and experienced) will also sign up for a track day where they can explore their motorcycle at or near the limit in a safer and controlled environment. BTW, as a beginner, you won't even know where your limits are. That's why it's advisable to go slowly and to learn on a smaller, less powerful bike. LEAVE YOUR EGO AT THE DOOR. Another important aspect of attitude is to fully understand road and traffic conditions and adjust your riding accordingly. Strive to acquire the valuable skill of "situational awareness" early on. There is so much more that you will need to understand. I know that it's a lot but it is worth the trouble if you wish to enjoy a long and enjoyable riding career. Best of luck and don't be afraid to ask questions

Very good advice...Take heed!