New Rider on an R6

[V8Thrasher]

So yesterday as I was heading over to my girlfriends house, I was at a stop light, waiting for the light to turn, and next to that intersection is the parking lot for a B of A, and I noticed the most unusual thing. Well its not that unusual after reading some of the newer riders comments. I saw a kid on what appeared to be a Yamaha R6. It was black (nice bike), and he was dressed in total blacked out gear. This kid must of just made a transaction or something as he was trying to leave, it was around 5pm so traffic was heavy in the parking lot, and I swear this kid couldnt find the friction zone for the life of him. He was revving WAY too high, and stalled 2-3 times. He would hop and jump forward as he would get the bike going. My light turned so I didnt see what happened with him.

This kid was obviously a novice. WHY THE HELL WOULD HE BE RIDING SUCH AN ADVANCED BIKE???? I dont understand people.

A week or 2 ago my brother and myself saw a kid on some sort of sportbike, it had a fat rear tire, and he kept stalling out at a light. Why are new riders so inclined to start off big? I just dont understand.

[JasonSK]

The badder your bike, the badder you are.

Till your dead.

I think it's peer pressure to have the coolest fastest bike around.

I started on a Honda Nighthawk 750, a big bike but I spent hours learning about the bike before I purchased it. Everyone said it was a good bike to learn on... and it was.

[marcn]

Comic relief!

[shubonker]

You have a responsibility as a standup citizen to go back there and take the bike for your own before he crashes it. GO!

[robow]

I think it is a I have the biggest and baddest too. These guys that buy monster bike right away probably don't have friends telling them they should start small an be safe. It is probably the exact opposite of that.

[V8Thrasher]

No way Shubonker....I know a guy who learned on a little Rebel then upgraded to an R6, but Im intimidated by Super Sport bikes lol.

And I have to agree, people get these bikes to "show off" not thinking how dangerous these things can be.

[Wavefunction]

Imagine how many lives would be saved by a tiered licensing system...

It's ridiculous that a 16 year old can go get a 600cc sportbike as their first bike.

[Girl]

I don't know what the big deal is. I have a 600cc and it's my first bike. I'm doing just fine.

Then again, I ride alone and I ride safely. I doubt I've used it to it's full capabilities but I enjoy it.

[V8Thrasher]

Originally Posted by Girl

I don't know what the big deal is. I have a 600cc and it's my first bike. I'm doing just fine.

Then again, I ride alone and I ride safely. I doubt I've used it to it's full capabilities but I enjoy it.

If you ride safely, +1 for you, alot of kids these days just want to show off. Stay safe!

Also...theres a BIG difference between many 600cc sportbikes and an R6. The Ninja 650 is a good beginner, as is the Honda CBR 600 and I know some riders have a Suzuki GSX 600 and i believe the 700cc GSXR has some sort of safety switch that lets you cut power in half. The R6, although a 600cc, is NOT a beginner bike.

[sirgilbert357]

Originally Posted by V8Thrasher

If you ride safely, +1 for you, alot of kids these days just want to show off. Stay safe!

Also...theres a BIG difference between many 600cc sportbikes and an R6. The Ninja 650 is a good beginner, as is the Honda CBR 600 and I know some riders have a Suzuki GSX 600 and i believe the 700cc GSXR has some sort of safety switch that lets you cut power in half. The R6, although a 600cc, is NOT a beginner bike.

Uhm...only the Ninja 650 is OK as a starter bike out of those you mentioned. The Honda CBR 600, the GSXR600 and the R6 are all way too much for a beginner and they are all in the exact same class: Supersports.

The Suzuki GSXR 750 (not 700) is also a supersport and the mode selector switch is helpful, but the bike itself is still a precision machine and not meant for a noob...

[shubonker]

Originally Posted by Girl

I don't know what the big deal is. I have a 600cc and it's my first bike. I'm doing just fine.

Then again, I ride alone and I ride safely. I doubt I've used it to it's full capabilities but I enjoy it.

Let's go for a ride

[V8Thrasher]

Originally Posted by sirgilbert357

Uhm...only the Ninja 650 is OK as a starter bike out of those you mentioned. The Honda CBR 600, the GSXR600 and the R6 are all way too much for a beginner and they are all in the exact same class: Supersports.

The Suzuki GSXR 750 (not 700) is also a supersport and the mode selector switch is helpful, but the bike itself is still a precision machine and not meant for a noob...

If the CBR600 and GSXR600 are in the same class as the R6, then your right. Just ive read of people starting on 600 CBRs and being perfectly fine.

But you seem to be more knowledgeable of the matter.

[Girl]

Originally Posted by shubonker

Let's go for a ride

Sure, as long as you don't drive all crazy like. Inbox me your number or somethin.

[Girl]

Originally Posted by sirgilbert357

Uhm...only the Ninja 650 is OK as a starter bike out of those you mentioned. The Honda CBR 600, the GSXR600 and the R6 are all way too much for a beginner and they are all in the exact same class: Supersports.

The Suzuki GSXR 750 (not 700) is also a supersport and the mode selector switch is helpful, but the bike itself is still a precision machine and not meant for a noob...

He said GSX 600, I think he was referring to the Katana.

[V8Thrasher]

^ I forgot all about the Katana. are those good startes? And the GSXR that has the safety mode that cuts off some power, there was a member on here who started off on that bike, and learned with the safety mode on, and after a few months rode it regular. Said it was a totally different bike, but the safety mode helped him learn how to control that thing.

[Girl]

That's what I have, and I like it. I've never felt it was too much power.

[Allison Wunderland]

"Dealers will sell anything to anybody." -- this the comment from the surfer/owner of a really tricked out short board.

Only requirement for buying a motor vehicle is a driver's license. No, it need not be motorcycle endorsed.

[Dodsfall]

Originally Posted by V8Thrasher

Just ive read of people starting on 600 CBRs and being perfectly fine.

I'm sure there are a lot of them. There are also a lot that get in over their heads and get hurt and/or frightened away from riding by choosing too much bike to learn on.

From my personal experience over the years, the large majority of riders I've known that start too big don't stick with it for very long for one reason or another. Most of those reasons are crashes (and even deaths) that might have been avoided by learning on a more forgiving machine. Most of the riders I've known that took the time to learn to ride competently on a more forgiving machine are still riding today.

[primalmu]

Originally Posted by Dodsfall

I'm sure there are a lot of them. There are also a lot that get in over their heads and get hurt and/or frightened away from riding by choosing too much bike to learn on.

+1

And unfortunately, we never hear from those guys who bought too much bike and abandoned riding shortly thereafter. The same ego that made them buy the big bike in the first place also prevented them from passing on the knowledge they learned from their failure.

Oh, and the Katana is NOT a good starter bike. Even though its old tech, it's still a lot of power (having had a Katana 600 and nearly gotten into trouble, I know from experience). It's also a very heavy bike, which is especially significant since sport bikes are top heavy by design.

And as far as the GSXRs with power modes, yea, that will make them easier to control, but there's no power mode for the brakes, which is probably the second most common place where new riders mess up on a performance bike. The brakes on sportbikes are insanely powerful compared to what you would find on a cruiser or a bike like a Ninja 650 or SV650. It's very easy to apply a little too much brake and lock the wheels.

[sirgilbert357]

Originally Posted by primalmu

+1

And unfortunately, we never hear from those guys who bought too much bike and abandoned riding shortly thereafter. The same ego that made them buy the big bike in the first place also prevented them from passing on the knowledge they learned from their failure.

Oh, and the Katana is NOT a good starter bike. Even though its old tech, it's still a lot of power (having had a Katana 600 and nearly gotten into trouble, I know from experience). It's also a very heavy bike, which is especially significant since sport bikes are top heavy by design.

And as far as the GSXRs with power modes, yea, that will make them easier to control, but there's no power mode for the brakes, which is probably the second most common place where new riders mess up on a performance bike. The brakes on sportbikes are insanely powerful compared to what you would find on a cruiser or a bike like a Ninja 650 or SV650. It's very easy to apply a little too much brake and lock the wheels.

+1 on all of this, ESPECIALLY the brakes comment. I wish people would just heed the wisdom and start small...

[Girl]

Originally Posted by primalmu

+1

And unfortunately, we never hear from those guys who bought too much bike and abandoned riding shortly thereafter. The same ego that made them buy the big bike in the first place also prevented them from passing on the knowledge they learned from their failure.

Oh, and the Katana is NOT a good starter bike. Even though its old tech, it's still a lot of power (having had a Katana 600 and nearly gotten into trouble, I know from experience). It's also a very heavy bike, which is especially significant since sport bikes are top heavy by design.

And as far as the GSXRs with power modes, yea, that will make them easier to control, but there's no power mode for the brakes, which is probably the second most common place where new riders mess up on a performance bike. The brakes on sportbikes are insanely powerful compared to what you would find on a cruiser or a bike like a Ninja 650 or SV650. It's very easy to apply a little too much brake and lock the wheels.

I have a Katana 600 and I say again. I'm doing fine. I actually did lock the wheels, but I did the right thing by not releasing the break.

[joekool4]

having just upgraded to an 03 r6 from a cruiser (almost tripling HP). From expirience i will tell you that i would have been dead if i started on this bike. I havent really gotten into the power that much yet, riding in my comfort zone, but then again ive only had it about a week, and its not the first sportbike ive ridden. Havent stalled it yet, just put in gear without the stand up. there are the older 600s though, mostly the "f" models, fzr600, gsx600f,cb600f(599 hornet) and cbr600f2,3,4 and f4i that could be good first bikes for someone who can take it easy.

[mikevillena]

This whole back and forth about what a newbie should be riding has been going on for a long time. Some folks say as long as you "respect" the bike, you'll be okay on a contemporary 600cc Supert Sport bike. To which I politely say "bullsh*t". Respect means squat to thinly disguised MotoGP bike with turn signals and mirrors. It is the lack of muscle memory, intuition, split second critical thinking, long range vision (both physical and mental), etc. that invariably causes a lot of accidents among newbies. These much needed skills will only come with experience. Respect will mean very little when you are leaned over on a turn and hit a bump and the front or rear gets a little skittish. Because a newbie will most likely have poor posture on an SS bike (i.e. bent forward and pushing down on their arms instead of gripping the tank with both legs and using your core muscles thus keeping both arms relaxed) that slight bump will translate to an unintended slight twist of the throttle. On a smaller 250 cc, that will mean very little because the throttle is very progressive. On a 600cc SS, the throttle is very touchy especially in the higher RPM range. Surprise!!!! The rear tire gets loose just a tad because of the unintended throttle input. The newbie's survival instinct is to either let off the throttle completely or grab the brakes. Oh yeah, those are the world-class MotoGP brakes that will easily do 150+ mph to 0 in less time than it takes to fart. Guess what, because our newbie also lacks the experienced touch needed to modulate the brakes he/she will lock-up a wheel. Depending on the speed and the lean angle, either action will almost lead to a lowside. Okay, same situation but instead of a bump, our newbie MotoGP wannabe hero hits a "tar snake". Experienced riders know what it's like. They know enough not to panic as the front or rear will slide just a tad but will regain grip as long as you don't add or chop the throttle. Without the actual experience, the newbie will also panic and the same survival instincts will kick in. I can go on and on but the point I'm trying to make is that nothing replaces hard, real world, on the saddle experience. You can read all about it, you can watch videos, you can talk about it but until you have actually done it, you know nothing. Start off on a 600cc Super Sport? Sure, anyone can do it. Even a trained monkey can ride fast in straight line. But motorcycling is a lot more than just going fast in a straight line. Chances are, most SS newbies will be so scared poopless after the first "oh sh*t" moment that they will either sell the damn bike or continue riding like grandmothers and will never really learn how to ride. However, a 250 cc rider will continue to benefit from the smooth and progressive throttle, the forgiving, easier to modulate brakes and relaxed steering geometry and they will eventually get damned good at it. And will be able to ride circles around our "failed" wannabe MotoGP hotshoe who's still riding an SS bike like a grandmother. And I have seen a LOT of them around. Sorry about the long post/rant/sarcasm. Let's cap it all off with a nice little video of a clueless newb on an R6. Sorry, but it's in Russian. And it's pretty darn graphic so be warned. Skip to about 4:50 Hint: TARGET FIXATION..... What?!?! You don't know what that means? And you are riding a f*cking motorcycle? And you're trying to post up advice to newbies?

http://youtu.be/0Q5dXLoRdNM

[Girl]

Originally Posted by mikevillena

This whole back and forth about what a newbie should be riding has been going on for a long time. Some folks say as long as you "respect" the bike, you'll be okay on a contemporary 600cc Supert Sport bike. To which I politely say "bullsh*t". Respect means squat to thinly disguised MotoGP bike with turn signals and mirrors. It is the lack of muscle memory, intuition, split second critical thinking, long range vision (both physical and mental), etc. that invariably causes a lot of accidents among newbies. These much needed skills will only come with experience. Respect will mean very little when you are leaned over on a turn and hit a bump and the front or rear gets a little skittish. Because a newbie will most likely have poor posture on an SS bike (i.e. bent forward and pushing down on their arms instead of gripping the tank with both legs and using your core muscles thus keeping both arms relaxed) that slight bump will translate to an unintended slight twist of the throttle. On a smaller 250 cc, that will mean very little because the throttle is very progressive. On a 600cc SS, the throttle is very touchy especially in the higher RPM range. Surprise!!!! The rear tire gets loose just a tad because of the unintended throttle input. The newbie's survival instinct is to either let off the throttle completely or grab the brakes. Oh yeah, those are the world-class MotoGP brakes that will easily do 150+ mph to 0 in less time than it takes to fart. Guess what, because our newbie also lacks the experienced touch needed to modulate the brakes he/she will lock-up a wheel. Depending on the speed and the lean angle, either action will almost lead to a lowside. Okay, same situation but instead of a bump, our newbie MotoGP wannabe hero hits a "tar snake". Experienced riders know what it's like. They know enough not to panic as the front or rear will slide just a tad but will regain grip as long as you don't add or chop the throttle. Without the actual experience, the newbie will also panic and the same survival instincts will kick in. I can go on and on but the point I'm trying to make is that nothing replaces hard, real world, on the saddle experience. You can read all about it, you can watch videos, you can talk about it but until you have actually done it, you know nothing. Start off on a 600cc Super Sport? Sure, anyone can do it. Even a trained monkey can ride fast in straight line. But motorcycling is a lot more than just going fast in a straight line. Chances are, most SS newbies will be so scared poopless after the first "oh sh*t" moment that they will either sell the damn bike or continue riding like grandmothers and will never really learn how to ride. However, a 250 cc rider will continue to benefit from the smooth and progressive throttle, the forgiving, easier to modulate brakes and relaxed steering geometry and they will eventually get damned good at it. And will be able to ride circles around our "failed" wannabe MotoGP hotshoe who's still riding an SS bike like a grandmother. And I have seen a LOT of them around. Sorry about the long post/rant/sarcasm. Let's cap it all off with a nice little video of a clueless newb on an R6. Sorry, but it's in Russian. And it's pretty darn graphic so be warned. Skip to about 4:50 Hint: TARGET FIXATION..... What?!?! You don't know what that means? And you are riding a f*cking motorcycle? And you're trying to post up advice to newbies?

http://youtu.be/0Q5dXLoRdNM

Man, you have encouraged me to go sell my bike and buy an Aprilia RS50.................................

I still stick buy it. I have no issues, have had a couple oh **** moments, hit a retarded amount of potholes on these god forsaken NY roads. Maybe it's not for everyone, but I don't have a problem with it. I have just as much of a chance dying on a dirtbike, or falling off a curb.

[Girl]

Anywho, I'll stop pissing people off. I will agree to disagree.

[SpitefulHam]

Originally Posted by mikevillena

Let's cap it all off with a nice little video of a clueless newb on an R6. Sorry, but it's in Russian. And it's pretty darn graphic so be warned. Skip to about 4:50 Hint: TARGET FIXATION..... What?!?! You don't know what that means? And you are riding a f*cking motorcycle? And you're trying to post up advice to newbies?

http://youtu.be/0Q5dXLoRdNM

The problem is statements and videos like that don't encourage new riders to start small anyway. Yes, it was an R6. And there was a passenger on the back. And it was in Russia. That's all we know. We don't know how experienced the rider was. We don't know how experienced his passenger was. We don't know the conditions of the bike. If it were a newer rider on a 250, could it still have happened if his passenger leaned the wrong way or if he had a sudden mechanical failure?

New riders are going to make mistakes. They probably will continue to make mistakes after they are "experienced" riders as well, but hopefully their experience will help them keep those mistakes from turning deadly. New riders increase their chances of success by starting small, but just as with everything in life, it guarantees nothing. You can die on a 250, you can succeed on a 1000, it boils down to the individual and their environment. At least that's my non-expert opinion.

[mikevillena]

@ Girl - The statement wasn't aimed at you. Sorry if you took it that way but I guess I'm fed up with posts made by other newbies telling other newbies that it's okay to start off on 120 bhp 600cc Super Sport bikes. It happens here and on other forums that I hang out in and with alarming frequency. I'm not telling anyone to go out and trade their bikes in for an RS50. The point is, the general consensus among the experienced riders here and elsewhere is that it is not a good idea to start off on an SS bike for many valid reasons. As to the chances of dying, I am not saying that a 250 guarantees immortality. However, a Ninja 250 cc is a better and more stable platform on which a newbie can ride and gain the much needed experience instead of a twitchy and unforgiving 600 cc SS. Sure, you can easily die on anything from a skateboard up to a fire breathing 'Busa. But why not stack the odds of survival on your side especially when you lack the skills and the experience? I wonder how many of those newbies who pass out poor advice are willing to pick up the pieces and pay the hospital bills of another newbie who gets into an accident because of their bad advice? And because this is a public forum which means that ANYONE can simply read everything that's posted, I wonder how many unregistered newbies are reading posts and walking into dealerships believing that it's okay to go and get that sexy GSXR600 or R6 because some dude on some forum VALIDATED what they wanted to do in the first place? Again, this is not specifically aimed at you but to the rank and file members here.

[Hawkeye]

Girl, I think within your responses lies the answer to the miscommunication. With most SS bikes, the real power is not noticeable until >6K rpm. If you just ride nice and casual it will not seem like too much power (my 08 R6 is even fairly tame below 6K rpm). When you hit 10K-16K rpm that is where it can get really scary real fast. Whole different beast. Most noobies and kids will not stay below the threshold, which is why they become that much more dangerous.

So while you may feel your bike is not too much power for you, it may just be because you have never ridden it like it was built to be ridden (raced). Nothing wrong with that, just an observation.