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Old 03-16-2011, 08:18 PM   #1
gardo
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Hey guys sorry for my first post being a negative one but i need to tell the tale.

I bought a motorcycle online from a company, Scooterdepot, out in CA and asked all the right questins about the bike being legal in my state of NJ. after a few calls and I decided on the bike a, which I thought was the CCW Tha Heist.

Well all that went well and the bike was delivered and the MSO came a few days later. Still good.

I go to my local MVC/DMV (this is where all went ill for our hero) and find I cannot legally title and register the bike in NJ, NY or PA

i contacted the seller who after being on hold and cut off a number of times, each call being 40+ minutes.

They tell me its an error at my DMV try another. So i give it a shot.

i get shot down after 4hrs in the DMV they will not title the bike.

i contacted the HQ of the DMV in the state capital of Trenton, and they tell me that the bike is illegal to own in NJ.
Now the bike has all the EPA and NHTSA tags and I dig a bit deeper and get a lovely woman from the DMV to give me some answers. The WMI reg of the manufacturer of the DF250RTB Dong fang Bobber has lapsed since 2004 and the bike is illegal.

Now a bit disheartened I called the company again 40+ min on hold and speak with a supervisor who insisted the Bike was legal to own. i then spoke to her manager and they contacted Trenton MVC today.

i get a call at 3pm EST that I need to ship the bike back to CA because its illegal to have in the states.

they stated they will be refunding my money but only after they get confirmation its on a pallet and going back to CA (understandable)

Hopefully, as they stated, they will be refunding my money in 3 -5 business days

moral of this story always check your local DMV before making a purchase of unknown brand vehicle. Motorcycle or otherwise. get the correct WMI and verify with the NHTSA about legality

Shame to nice bike
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Old 03-16-2011, 08:31 PM   #2
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Yikes that sounds like a nightmare. So the bike is illegal in CA as well?
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Old 03-16-2011, 08:42 PM   #3
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Yikes that sounds like a nightmare. So the bike is illegal in CA as well?
Yes the DF250RTB is not CARB approved
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Old 03-16-2011, 09:33 PM   #4
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Bummer for you but that company is screwed!
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Old 03-16-2011, 09:39 PM   #5
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Situations like this are precisely why I don't own any guns.

Try these guys; http://www.oldschoolhardknock.com/
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Old 03-16-2011, 09:59 PM   #6
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I checked them out Nice setup. I actually contacted PITMotarsLTD about the CCW Heist via email and they were quick to respond. As I got talking to the guy and was explaining the situation he says he read about something similar on another board I post to. Low and behold it was me that made the post that he read.
After almost an hour on the phone he invited me down to his facility to talk some more. Hell he even offered the ship _my illegal bike back for me. I'm gonna go down maybe on Friday and check them out. At least I know these bikes are legal in the states
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Old 03-17-2011, 12:18 PM   #7
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Well the bike is wrapped and secured to a pallet and being picked up after 6pm EST. What kills me its in the 60s and sunny and I cant go riding today.
Looks like it will be 2 weeks before I get a new bike
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Old 03-17-2011, 12:33 PM   #8
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Quote:
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Situations like this are precisely why I don't own any guns.

[/url]
This is why I own a bunch of guns and don't live in New York
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Old 03-17-2011, 07:48 PM   #9
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There's a lot to be said for buying from a dealership that you can walk into. There's even more to be said for buying a brand that has been around for a few decades and has an established reputation.

We learn from our experiences, especially the bad ones.
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Old 03-17-2011, 08:41 PM   #10
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True enough, but as online purchasing goes this is my first bad one. Maybe I've been lucky, but the bike was picked up this evening and freighted away now comes the ordeal about getting my money back and looking for something else.
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Old 03-18-2011, 02:32 AM   #11
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Having been part of the scooter community in the past this is an all too familiar story. It seems to hit the scooter community harder since the number of China scoots running around in the US seems to be much higher than Chinese motorcycles. Bottom line is that the imported Chinese Scooters/motorcycles are a bad investment all around. Quality is as random as a roll of the dice, parts and service are questionable at best, the distribution network is shady at best, and they discontinue and change out models, product names, etc. Incidentally these questionable machines are also illegal in Oregon and there are a growing number of states that are making them illegal due to things such as the story in the OP. One poor guy was actually told by the site he bought his scooter from to change one of the numbers on the VIN and that his bike would be perfectly legal.

Bottom line NEVER buy a bike over the i-net. Be smart and buy a used bike locally from one of the trusty labels (Kawasaki, Suzuki, Yamaha or Honda), save yourself some money and tons of hassle to boot.

Incidentally I assume that this is the bike:

http://www.scooterdepot.us/250cc-Cus...kes-p-731.html

MC is the designation usually used by the likes of Motobravo/Rocketa which are well known for their cheap quality garbage. As long as you get your money back, consider yourself lucky.
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Old 03-18-2011, 10:59 PM   #12
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jesterrace - i got a call from Sunny Sports that I will have my full refund and shipping by next Friday. Lets hope it all works out.
the bike itself seemed solid. i'm a bit of a gear head and no stranger to a wrench, but in truth its BS if you cant legally title a vehicle from these companies and why the fed is letting them import these machines if they dont meet the standards
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Old 03-20-2011, 08:54 PM   #13
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Because they are still legal in the majority of states at this point. It's up to the states DMVs to gang up on them and then run them out of the country. As for the bike itself, that is the way they all seem at first. Take a look around at the number of Rocketa, Motobravo, Tank, TN'G scooters/bikes that are less than 5 years old but have some kind of busted part (not due to laying it down or being hit). The bottom line is that if you do get a refund, consider yourself lucky to get out of it. Plenty of older Yamaha and Honda bobbers in your price range.
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Old 03-20-2011, 11:42 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesterrace View Post
Bottom line is that the imported Chinese Scooters/motorcycles are a bad investment all around. Quality is as random as a roll of the dice, parts and service are questionable at best, the distribution network is shady at best, and they discontinue and change out models, product names, etc.
But they do have wonderfully funny translations on the warning labels.

Kidding aside, I can see a day when a Chinese company will rise to the level of the Japanese in all the areas we have concerns with. I don't think these companies are founded with the notion of delivering a deliberately shoddy product, and I think the workers in those factories are not striving to turn out the worst product they can.

One day there will be a manufacturer that understands the value of their good name and reputation and that company will thrive.....and be ripped off by the knock off producer in the next "emerging economic market".

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Old 03-21-2011, 02:02 AM   #15
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Yes and no. The problem is that Chinese workers are demanding to see more of the profits. Not bad for the Chinese people by any means, but it means that those dirt cheap wages that companies have been profiting off of for the last couple of decades are threatened. My guess is that China will probably be more like Japan is now, and focus more on the local economy in the coming years. As for quality, who knows. My guess is that Thailand and Vietnam will be the next business targets for exploitation (already being done for clothing).
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Old 03-21-2011, 11:24 AM   #16
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The Truth is that china is under development and getting better. On my business trip out to Shenzhen China, were the iPAD and iPhone is made, there is a lot of focus on the worker and their well being as well as wages. The Chinese govt is demanding higher wages and it was passed in Nov 2010.

you gotta read Scot's blog from the last page forward. http://www.clevelandcyclewerks.com/blog/

People were getting on my about a "China Bike" but this is a true American company that like other bike manufacturers has parts manufactured in china. I give it up to Scotty for having the balls to start a new brand in the States.

Thats why I support him
I am proud to support these guys and PIT Motors LTD
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Old 03-21-2011, 02:43 PM   #17
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The bottom line is that it is a poor decision to spend $3K+ on a brand new 250 China bike of any kind. What are you going to do if these guys go out of business (either PIT motors or clevelandcycleworks), you will find that precious few individuals will touch them if you run into a problem that you can't tackle and you have no idea what some people have had to go through trying to find parts for their scooters/bikes. You would be amazed at how difficult it can be to find even the most basic of parts (ie turn signal, mirror, tires). While it is true that a number of big name manufacturers outsource to China for parts there is a big difference between a big name company having it's own employees monitoring quality control and the Chinese companies being left to their own devices. I don't doubt that the folks at CCW are better than Scooter Depot but the fact remains that they are using stuff directly from China and there is no real guarantee for parts or the quality of the components used to build a bike. Furthermore NEVER sit there and read through blogs, postings on the company's own site. I'm sure Scooter Depot has some excellent reviews on their products and promising the world in their blog. It's just frustrating when you see people throwing away so much money when there are far better alternatives for less money. I see custom built Suzuki, Yamaha, etc. 650 bobbers all the time on my local craigslist for under $2500. The bikes although more powerful than a 250 are not insane speed machines and would still be a good choice for a first time rider. The bikes will also outlast your China bike in just about every respect, to say nothing of the fact that if you took a trip with one and something broke down you could easily find a place to give you parts and service. The same is not true of the China bike. The other thing is that the Chinese bikes suffer from serious depreciation. Seen Plenty of people who bought Lifan based mini-choppers for $2500-$3500 and then throw them on craigslist for less than $1K and they are only 2-3 years old (they also usually have something minor wrong with them, ie non-functioning turns signals, broken chain tensioner). So if you ever plan on upgrading in a year or two you are going to eat it seriously on re-sale value. As for the speeds. With the exception of the 250 Ninja (which has 6 gears), no 250 stock will cruise at any speed higher than about 60MPH, your peak speed with the throttle cranked wide open can reach 70-75MPH, but it is not a good idea for a 200lbs man to maintain those kinds of speeds for any extended period of time. Point of fact I don't think you will be able to see those speeds given your weight. I think about 60-65MPH will be your top end. Bottom line is that with a $3K budget you can do so much better for the money with better quality control and still fulfill your bobber obsession.
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Old 03-21-2011, 07:23 PM   #18
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Jeterrace - all valid points and I see what you are saying and will need to agree to disagree.

My brother made the same argument, he's a big HD guy and tried pointing me in a used bike to convert or get one thats already been done. He's also brought up the engine size and the stability of a startup company

I know i am taking a chance with this bike but its something i would like to tryout. there is a lot of support being put together for this company worldwide and even now in the states. When i visited the facility and saw the racks and rack of not only parts but frames. I was impressed and all the units that are slotted for dealerships in the US.

I tend to be a first adapter for a lot of things some pan out others not so much, then there are those items which are ahead of the times. We never know. Hell we could be seeing the birth of a long run company or what might be the next Delorean.

I appreciate the input and please keep it coming its good to talk to seasoned guys like yourself and get the feedback

Thank you
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Old 03-21-2011, 07:26 PM   #19
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The situation sounded like a nightmare. I'm sorry you had to go through all of that trouble just to get a bike and find out that it isn't legal where you live. Well, morals are learned from out mistakes.
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Old 04-20-2013, 05:47 PM   #20
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Democrats run your state.
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Old 04-20-2013, 08:45 PM   #21
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Good heads up Gardo. It is unfortunate that you had to go through it so that we could learn from you.
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Old 04-20-2013, 10:02 PM   #22
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move to S. Dakota.
register it as a Yamaha.
No-one will ever know.

dT
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Old 04-20-2013, 10:09 PM   #23
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Did I miss it? Did you get your money back?
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Old 04-21-2013, 01:21 AM   #24
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move to S. Dakota.
register it as a Yamaha.
No-one will ever know.

dT
Kind of like how my bike is branded as UM, my insurance list it as a Hyosung, my registration says its a Suzuki. Whatever.
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Old 04-21-2013, 09:09 AM   #25
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Don't rely on a salesman's pitch. Do the homework yourself first to avoid such problems.
While perhaps a bit biased, I'd be very leary of anything these type of sites sell. Their presentation and "prices" just scream "stay away". When list prices are that o a GOOD, better brand model...well, you see the light on this right? Their 3-wheel models are "list" at just a bit below a Spyder...yeah sure.
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