Is it best to let my motorcycle warm up before I ride? - Motorcycle Forum
Motorcycle Forum

Go Back   Motorcycle Forum > Motorcycle Forums > General Motorcycle Discussion



Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 05-28-2010, 07:38 PM   #1
Warden
Master At Arms
 
Warden's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: NYC
Posts: 182
Warden is an unknown quantity at this point
Default Is it best to let my motorcycle warm up before I ride?

According to article HERE it is OK to just start your car and drive right away because its injector and it knows how much fuel to add.

So what about motorcycle with injector? Is it the same?

Just to add. Lets talk about reasonable 40F-60F temperatures. Nothing North Pole extreme.

Last edited by Warden; 05-28-2010 at 07:40 PM..
Warden is offline   Reply With Quote

Advertisement [Remove Advertisement]
Old 05-28-2010, 08:59 PM   #2
internationalballer
Senior Member
 
internationalballer's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 2,845
internationalballer is on a distinguished road
Default

I don't have and injected bike (I wish I did) but I have 2 friends with them. 1 never lets his warm up and the other will let it idle for a minute or so. They have never had any sputtering problems taking off without letting it warm up.
internationalballer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2010, 09:44 PM   #3
smooth1
Senior Member
 
smooth1's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Certainly not the Emerald City
Posts: 471
smooth1 is on a distinguished road
Default

I always allow my carburated bike to warm up a few minute before riding.
smooth1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2010, 10:28 PM   #4
marcn
It's all about attitude
 
marcn's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Murphy,North Carolina
Posts: 880
marcn is on a distinguished road
Default

I have FI but the reason I idle mine before riding is to allow the oil to circulate before heading out.
__________________
Keep our troops in our prayers
marcn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2010, 10:33 PM   #5
David 1
Senior Member
 
David 1's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 1,459
David 1 will become famous soon enough
Default

I believe the oil comes up within 5 or 10 seconds. That is about what I wait.
Even with a carb. you have a choke, which allows you to warm up ... while you ride.
The worst possible gas mileage you can get is ... sitting ... warming up. And you get all the usual wear and tear on your engine.
If I have to wait at the train tracks for more than 20 seconds, on the bike or in the car, I shut the engine down.
Why waste the engine and the gas? And pollute the atmosphere. No reason.
The mild strain of the engine while rolling out is the best way to 'warm up' the engine.
dc
David 1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2010, 10:35 PM   #6
vulpine
Verified
 
vulpine's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Central PA.
Posts: 96
vulpine is on a distinguished road
Default

I was told to allow my bike, injected, to warm up but more for the oil flow reasons.
__________________
2004 Suzuki Marauder
vulpine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2010, 11:02 PM   #7
mrfizban
Road Captain
 
mrfizban's Avatar

Join Date: May 2010
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 86
mrfizban is on a distinguished road
Default

I have FI and I never go more than 5-10 seconds before I'm taking off after I hit the ignition. I've never noticed one difference vs another in the 4-5 years now since I've had a FI bike.
mrfizban is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2010, 11:57 PM   #8
rexmitchell
Administrator
 
rexmitchell's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: THE ATX
Posts: 14,791
rexmitchell has a spectacular aura about
Default

Even with a FI bike it should be warmed up for a minute or two. Cars are designed differently and are ok to take off in immediately.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


You may all go to Hell, and I will go to Texas. - Davy Crockett
rexmitchell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2010, 12:02 AM   #9
RUMBLEBK
Master At Arms
 
RUMBLEBK's Avatar

Join Date: May 2010
Location: Idaho, & Southern Nevada
Posts: 192
RUMBLEBK is on a distinguished road
Default

Fact of the matter is whether carb or injected, metal parts like rings, cylinder walls, gears perform better when warm, and wear less when warm. It is a fact that even injected engines get horrible milage when they are cold. It is best on a injected engine to warm it up for one minute. On a carb engine, it takes a bit longer at about 2 minutes. In the long run you will save fuel, and wear and tear on your engine.

I have cars and trucks that have 300,000 miles on the original engine using this method. Motorcycles can use the same TLC.

This can be subsatnsiated in any car and driver magazine or any motorcycle magazine in which tests were performed.
RUMBLEBK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2010, 01:09 AM   #10
point
Senior Member
 
point's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Vancouver British Columbia Canada
Posts: 435
point is on a distinguished road
Default

And lets not forget a wet clutch in cold weather. Untill the oil is warmed up your bike will not shift as well.
My bike is carburated and does not preform well for the forst minute of idling.
point is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2010, 02:24 AM   #11
Weebel
Banned

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Minnesota (it sucks)
Posts: 770
Weebel is on a distinguished road
Default

TO ensure a longer life of the engine you should always let the motor warm up before driving / or riding anywhere regardless of what it is. (assuming is has an internal combustion engine anyway)

Pistons are actually helical shaped you just cant see it, they are cut that way so when they expend from heat the rings set properly once to operating temperature, plus once at operating temperature, your oil will be at the proper viscosity, and your engine more fully lubricated.
Weebel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2010, 07:00 AM   #12
Jeff10236
Senior Member

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Odenton, Maryland
Posts: 740
Jeff10236 is on a distinguished road
Default

I was told to let mine warm up (a 2009 Suzuki C50). I don't let it sit long however. I go out to my bike, put it in neutral and start the engine, and then zip my jacket, put on my helmet, put on my gloves, and I figure by then it should be warmed up enough to start my ride (and for the first minute or two I take it a little easier on the throttle just in case).
Jeff10236 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2010, 07:39 AM   #13
Haglaz
Nigerian Billionaire
 
Haglaz's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: The Internet
Posts: 690
Haglaz is on a distinguished road
Default

I let my FZR warm up for about one cigarette or so. It just behaves funny when it's cold.
Haglaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2010, 10:29 AM   #14
FlyingDuc
Guest

Posts: n/a
Default

My Duc has a flashing indicator that won't turn off until the bike is properly warmed up. It sometimes takes 4-5 minutes.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2010, 10:34 AM   #15
soxOZ
Aussie Cruizer
 
soxOZ's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: The Best Place on the Planet...
Posts: 124
soxOZ is on a distinguished road
Default

The reality is that you should start to ride/drive as soon as you start your engine (and it doesn't matter what type of induction you have) as if its tuned correctly it should be drivable.

Your better off to ride gently than to just let it sit and idle, and the reason is that even if the oil is cold, it is thin enough (that's why they make multi grade oil 10W-40 etc) to lubricate all the the bottom end of the motor etc, but usually the only way the cylinder walls are lubricated on modern engines is by oil throw from the crank / rods, and on idle it only receives the minimal amount to lubricate the cylinder walls...
And this is when you will get the highest wear rate with the engine being cold and low lubrication...
This idea of warming up the engine comes from way back when oil was a constant weight (e.g. straight 30, 40 or 50 weight) and it didn't flow easily, it was like treacle at times.
But all modern oils will flow cold and give you engine all the protection it needs right from the minute you start it.
If you live in an extremely cold location you can get 0W-20 weight oil, or for the hotter climates 20W-50, but usually a 10W-30/40 weight oil will work efficiently in most average climates.
So choose your oil weight to match the climate you live and ride in...

Plus the motor will heat a lot quicker if driven than just left idling... If you really feel that you need to warm the engine first, do it a favor, don't let it idle and keep the revs up at about 1000 to 1200rpm at least to allow enough lube to mist the internal of the engine...
__________________
Wally...
2010 Honda Shadow Spirit VT750C2 FI...
soxOZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2010, 10:54 AM   #16
markk53
Rough Writer
 
markk53's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Delaware, Ohio
Posts: 3,842
markk53 has a spectacular aura about
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by soxOZ View Post
The reality is that you should start to ride/drive as soon as you start your engine (and it doesn't matter what type of induction you have) as if its tuned correctly it should be drivable.

Your better off to ride gently than to just let it sit and idle, and the reason is that even if the oil is cold, it is thin enough (that's why they make multi grade oil 10W-40 etc) to lubricate all the the bottom end of the motor etc, but usually the only way the cylinder walls are lubricated on modern engines is by oil throw from the crank / rods, and on idle it only receives the minimal amount to lubricate the cylinder walls...
And this is when you will get the highest wear rate with the engine being cold and low lubrication...
This idea of warming up the engine comes from way back when oil was a constant weight (e.g. straight 30, 40 or 50 weight) and it didn't flow easily, it was like treacle at times.
But all modern oils will flow cold and give you engine all the protection it needs right from the minute you start it.
If you live in an extremely cold location you can get 0W-20 weight oil, or for the hotter climates 20W-50, but usually a 10W-30/40 weight oil will work efficiently in most average climates.
So choose your oil weight to match the climate you live and ride in...

Plus the motor will heat a lot quicker if driven than just left idling... If you really feel that you need to warm the engine first, do it a favor, don't let it idle and keep the revs up at about 1000 to 1200rpm at least to allow enough lube to mist the internal of the engine...
Great!

Essentially exactly what every article and every knowledgable person I've spoken to has implied. If the bike can smoothly pull away under its own power it's fine. Those people includes trained mechanics and other service related people with some good background.

In my case with Kawasakis I ride away within less than 30 seconds normally. After all it has to be better to ride off at some normal rate than to be sitting there fighting with the Kawasaki enrichener 3000-5000 rpm "idle". It's almost an on/off switch! Apparently Kawasaki never believed in real chokes like Honda did. Both would rev their guts out if I didn't try to adjust the enrichener, and still if not careful they will stall or take off again on the revs. So I'm rolling as quick as I can get going.

If your oil pump works there's adequate lube everywhere within a second - simple hydraulics dictates that. And for easy starting and rollling the load on the engine is so low it's not going to cause any undue stress or heat. In fact it seems on an air cooled engine it would be better. And the cooling air on the exhaust helps too. In all my years of sales I could almost always tell you who warmed bikes up for extended periods by the coloration on their exhaust.

Regardless, you're going to get those "warm it up for at least 3 (or five or whatever) minutes" comments, because that's what they were told. Much like a lot of other "folklore" of motorcycling from the 1930s and 40s that has persisted well into the new millenium, some car stuff has done the same. "If it was good enough for grandpa on his 45 flat head Harley it's good enough for my 20-- in-line four or whatever... like nothing's changed in chemicals, metalurgy, and machining, along with engineering, in the past 65 years or so.
__________________
KLX650C, Zephyr 550
SR500, Bultaco Sherpa T
markk53 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2010, 11:14 AM   #17
Stainlesstehle
A legend in his own mind
 
Stainlesstehle's Avatar

Join Date: May 2010
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 2,190
Stainlesstehle will become famous soon enough
Default

Alot of good advice all around. Read your owners manual.. Mine says to let it warm for 2-3 min. no longer than 5.
Runs poorly if I don't anyways, aircooled 03 V-Star1100
__________________
2003 VStar 1100
1983 KZ 1100 Spectre
Wife
Stainlesstehle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2010, 11:59 AM   #18
point
Senior Member
 
point's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Vancouver British Columbia Canada
Posts: 435
point is on a distinguished road
Default

This is a great thread. A lot of opposing opinions and few of them are actually wrong. I was trained as a mechanic in the army in the 60s. We had very old equipment and ran single viscosity oils. So the rule was that you had to bring the engine up to temperature befor putting it under load.
Today we have multi weight oills and engines made of materials that were not available back them. So yes, you can start up and take off. My new pickup truck is a fuel injected standard. I start it up in the morning and idle and idle off down the driveway to the stop sign at the end of the srteet and then I'm gone. My bike however is 25 years old and carburated. It is well tuned and maintained but with the wet clutch and all, it does not do well till it has run for at least a full minute.
So as has been said befor, do what the owners manual or dealer mech says.
point is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2010, 12:02 PM   #19
soxOZ
Aussie Cruizer
 
soxOZ's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: The Best Place on the Planet...
Posts: 124
soxOZ is on a distinguished road
Default

I've been a Design Engineer for over 30+ years and most of that time has been in the automotive industry...

And for a period there I wrote the workshop manuals (Chrysler & Mitsubishi) that you guys read and treat like bibles, but let me tell you something, the manufactures are more concerned that you vehicle (bike or car) is drivable without problems than what may be the best for it at times. They are not too concerned if you bike is worn out at 80k or gets over 200k, as the reality is you won't probably own it by the time it gets to this mileage, that's if you bought it brand new.
And then the guy (or gal) that buys it and then finds its worn out, just puts it down to the previous owner's misuse or neglect and not a bad procedures in its earlier years of use...

Now just because the owners manual says something, and I know, most will say that this is all I can go by, there are sometimes better ways. Look, if you follow what the manual says, you will get the expected service life from the vehicle, but this service life usually not stated anywhere in the manual...

If you read what you just said "Stainlesstehle", "Read your owners manual.. Mine says to let it warm for 2-3 min. no longer than 5. Runs poorly if I don't anyways" you will see what I'm saying, it was easier for Yamaha to tell you to warm it up than to fix it so that it's rideable from cold.
This doesn't mean that they skip on all things, but in this case it was an acceptable solution to solve the problem for them...

But I don't believe that it's acceptable for any modern day vehicle to have to do this. You should be able to start it and ride whether it's from cold or a hot start... JMHO...
__________________
Wally...
2010 Honda Shadow Spirit VT750C2 FI...
soxOZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2010, 12:20 PM   #20
Stainlesstehle
A legend in his own mind
 
Stainlesstehle's Avatar

Join Date: May 2010
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 2,190
Stainlesstehle will become famous soon enough
Default

I agree soxOZ, one should be able to. So please "fix" mine. Two dealers and one private shop have told me thats how they run. It has been checked and thats the best I get. So you are correct and thats all I have to go by. I wish I could start driving cold like my car.
I'm open for any suggestions
__________________
2003 VStar 1100
1983 KZ 1100 Spectre
Wife
Stainlesstehle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2010, 12:36 PM   #21
FlyingDuc
Guest

Posts: n/a
Default

I've had several motorcycles and none have had as much character or spunk as my FI air cooled desmodromic engine. The design has been around forever, but it sure works. I'm willing to spend a few extra minutes to let it warm up. It also gives me time to think about my trip and get my head straight before a long ride.
  Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2010, 03:23 PM   #22
kabory
Senior Member
 
kabory's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: North Wilmington, Delaware
Posts: 622
kabory is on a distinguished road
Default

My stock shadow would stall out after about 30 seconds from start if I didnt pull the choke out for a couple of seconds first. With the rejet I just had done, I have not had to choke my bike at all.
kabory is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-30-2010, 04:41 AM   #23
tom10167
Senior Member

Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 539
tom10167 is on a distinguished road
Default

Both my carburated star 650 and my FI/liquid cooled Star 1300 run a little warmer after a minute or two of actual riding.

The 650 in Phoenix took about 30 seconds of choke in the 50 degree weather, and riding it was definitely tough gradually getting in to first for the first 1-2 minutes.


The 1300 I start, put on my gloves, and then go, it's not as bad but it's still a tad choppy for the first minute or so.
tom10167 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-30-2010, 05:11 AM   #24
Kingshead
Banned

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Sierra Mnts. Ca.
Posts: 1,289
Kingshead is on a distinguished road
Default

If it's cold I pull the choke, start the bike, wait 10-15 seconds and I'm off. If it's warm no choke, start the bike, 1 or 2 revs and I'm off. My drive is 300' long, steep downward grade, and dirt. So this allows for a slow start and the bike is ready when I reach the bottom for normal riding without the choke, warm or cold.

Honda VT1100C A.C.E., (synthetic oil)

Last edited by Kingshead; 05-30-2010 at 05:14 AM..
Kingshead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-30-2010, 09:27 AM   #25
Stainlesstehle
A legend in his own mind
 
Stainlesstehle's Avatar

Join Date: May 2010
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 2,190
Stainlesstehle will become famous soon enough
Default

My bike is ready to go by the time I get my helmet and gloves on anyway.
__________________
2003 VStar 1100
1983 KZ 1100 Spectre
Wife
Stainlesstehle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-30-2010, 05:22 PM   #26
Weebel
Banned

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Minnesota (it sucks)
Posts: 770
Weebel is on a distinguished road
Default

Just by knowing how every single thing in an engine works and why..... I know that letting it warm up by idling is better then riding it.

Regardless though...

On my Old Suzuki, I let her warm up until it will idle without the choke, and my ZX6R's temp gauge reads blank until its warmed up, I'll let it sit on High idle until I get a reading (comes on at about 104)
Weebel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-30-2010, 08:36 PM   #27
David 1
Senior Member
 
David 1's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 1,459
David 1 will become famous soon enough
Default

Actually, if you are going to sit there and run your bike without going anywhere, the best way is at the lowest possible rpms you can do. High rpms just puts more stress and strain on all the parts, and adds to friction and wear on the engine.
dc
David 1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-30-2010, 09:19 PM   #28
Denotion
Verified
 
Denotion's Avatar

Join Date: May 2010
Location: St. Louis, MO
Posts: 50
Denotion is on a distinguished road
Default

This reminds me of how often you are supposed to change the oil versus how often the mechanic says you need to change the oil. I had a VW Jetta that said to change the oil every 7,500 miles. My friend who is a mechanic about threw a fit when I showed it to him in the manual. When I mentioned it at the dealership they said the 3,000 miles thing is 1960's information that some people just won't let go of.
Denotion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-30-2010, 09:47 PM   #29
Kingshead
Banned

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Sierra Mnts. Ca.
Posts: 1,289
Kingshead is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Denotion View Post
This reminds me of how often you are supposed to change the oil versus how often the mechanic says you need to change the oil. I had a VW Jetta that said to change the oil every 7,500 miles. My friend who is a mechanic about threw a fit when I showed it to him in the manual. When I mentioned it at the dealership they said the 3,000 miles thing is 1960's information that some people just won't let go of.
Let's face it, the more often you can afford to change your oil the better, period. It's absolutely impossible to change it too often so I say err on the safe side. The synthetic oils definately break down slower but it's relatively cheap now so I say change it anyways. Engine failure is never cheap, and since our bikes also use the same oil for the tranny it's even more important.

I realize this may not be the enviromentally politically correct thing to do, but if the used oil isn't as broken down we can use it in our lawn mowers, and recycling is just that much more feasable.

Last edited by Kingshead; 05-30-2010 at 10:30 PM..
Kingshead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-30-2010, 10:01 PM   #30
Stainlesstehle
A legend in his own mind
 
Stainlesstehle's Avatar

Join Date: May 2010
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 2,190
Stainlesstehle will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingshead View Post
Let's face it, the more often you can afford to change your oil the better, period. It's absolutely impossible to change it too often so I say err on the safe side. The synthetic oils definately break down slower but it's relatively cheap now so I say change it anyways. Engine failure is never cheap, and since our bikes also use the same oil for the tranny it's even more important.
I hear ya there!
__________________
2003 VStar 1100
1983 KZ 1100 Spectre
Wife
Stainlesstehle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-30-2010, 11:56 PM   #31
bluesjr
Master At Arms
 
bluesjr's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: sf bay
Posts: 153
bluesjr is on a distinguished road
Default

I wasn't warming mine up much initially, but just happened to overhear Yamaha's service rep tell a customer that you have to warm it up a couple of minutes to get the oil pressure up.

I usually start it, and by the time I've got my helmet, glasses, and gloves on, and the garage buttoned up, I can get on and ride. And by then, I don't need the choke.

Btw, my manual says use the full choke for 7 seconds (if I remember right), then go to half choke. When I get on the bike, I'm usually able to completely shut down the choke.
bluesjr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-31-2010, 12:36 AM   #32
soxOZ
Aussie Cruizer
 
soxOZ's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: The Best Place on the Planet...
Posts: 124
soxOZ is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Denotion View Post
This reminds me of how often you are supposed to change the oil versus how often the mechanic says you need to change the oil. I had a VW Jetta that said to change the oil every 7,500 miles. My friend who is a mechanic about threw a fit when I showed it to him in the manual. When I mentioned it at the dealership they said the 3,000 miles thing is 1960's information that some people just won't let go of.
This may be true if there is no contamination of the oil, and IMHO this mileage between oil changes should only be considered on a motor that has gone way past its break in procedure and this would be around the 10-12k mile mark. As during this time there are still a lot of loose metal particles that end up in the oil during the break-in period.

If you don't want to change your oil more frequently for whatever reason, do your motor a favour and at least change the oil filter around every 3k max during break in and about 5k after if your one who like to max out the mileage of your oil. But this is all relative to your driving style, as if you’re going to go from NY to LA, you could do this without any problem or thought about any oil changes (on an engine that's broken in), but if you’re just cruzin around the city and in traffic with the occasional blast into the country side, you will need to look closer at more frequent changes..
My Oil/Oil filter change intervals on any new motor are 500miles, 1000miles, 2500miles and 5000miles, and then every 5000miles or 6months whichever comes first. And I have done this on all the new drives (bikes or cars) I have owned...

I know oils like Amsoil claim that you can get at least 25k between changes and this is where you need to change filters more often as this is the trash can for bits collected by the oil and you need to empty the trash can a bit more often than replace synthetic oil. Oil only needs to be replaced when it stops doing what it was designed for or becomes contaminated, usually more with time than mileage.

But having said that, the reality is that only about 2-5% of bikes, and I'm being generous with this figure will be lucky to travel 5k during a year, and although synthetic oil will do the mileage, it won’t do the time. Even Amsoil (which is ranked highly) say that oil should be change every year no matter what mileage, and this is because of the acid build up in the oil over time.

Just wondering when this thread went from how long before riding to the basic knowledge of oils... LOL... But I guess the 2 are related...

For me, my cold start procedure... I’m sitting all geared up, push the starter, and ride off (just normally) as soon as it started...
This way to contradictory to the beliefs of many, riding off as soon as it's started will cause the least amount of wear on the motor during a cold start up with the best oil protection and will get to operating temperature the quickest...

That’s if you bike is rideable and if it’s not, well that’s another problem & story...
If you don’t believe me, well ask another Engineer besides me... ...
__________________
Wally...
2010 Honda Shadow Spirit VT750C2 FI...
soxOZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-31-2010, 12:36 AM   #33
Soulless
Verified

Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 69
Soulless is on a distinguished road
Default

At least 2 minutes for my 2010 ninja 250R and for all my cars. In the winter, my cars have to sit for @ least 10 mins before i take off...


anyone know why it's bad for a motorcycle to idle for a long time? it said that in my kawasaki manual..
Soulless is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-31-2010, 01:06 AM   #34
Ramsfan87
Senior Member
 
Ramsfan87's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Albany, NY
Posts: 413
Ramsfan87 is on a distinguished road
Default

I tend to just let it idle/warm up while I'm putting on my jacket, helmet, and gloves. Then I'm usually off. If its a cold engine I use some choke until it idles well with the choke off. Part of the reason I do that is because my choke is not in a easily accessible area while riding. On the vstar 650 its under the seat on the left side. If it was on the handlebars, I wouldn't wait until my bike is idling well without the choke before I take off. I'd ride it with some choke until its warm.
Ramsfan87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-31-2010, 03:05 AM   #35
Kingshead
Banned

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Sierra Mnts. Ca.
Posts: 1,289
Kingshead is on a distinguished road
Default

Contrary to popular belief the danger from running the oil too long isn't from metal paticles in the oil (the oil pan has a magnet installed for this purpose) it's carbon deposits. Carbon is what diamonds are constructed from and the individual particles are more abrasive than sandpaper. Since the carbon is not iron based the magnet will not attract these and will stay suspended in the oil. Some filters are better at removing these particles, but they very greatly in size and some will always pass through. The acid build up is another issue entirely, but this problem will also be addressed with frequent changes.

In case you are wondering about my expertise on this issue, I spent a good portion of my life as a machinist manufacturing jet turbine engines for Pratt and Whitney, heat treating air hardened tool steels, and just basic metalurgy. We used many different types of lubricants (some even water based) for cutting and other purposes. We even used some as a dialetric for Electro-discharge machining with carbon graphite as an electrode so this was a major concern. And of all the different exotic metals we worked with, machining the graphite was the most abrasive materials to work with.

I've already commented on the warm up period, but from what I'm reading here on this thread there seems to be two schools of thought. This is a very provocative issue and apparently of great interest to all. I've owned quite a few vehicles in my life and driven many past the 250,000 mile mark, one over 400,000. I've never been one to immediately drive off after starting, but I've also never waited for any prolonged amount of time either (usually about 20-30 seconds). I'm not really sure if this relates directly to bikes but I just like to give the oil pump enough time to lubricate the overhead cams on my high performance vehicles before creating higher rpm's. Just me.
Kingshead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-31-2010, 09:01 AM   #36
tom10167
Senior Member

Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 539
tom10167 is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soulless View Post
At least 2 minutes for my 2010 ninja 250R and for all my cars. In the winter, my cars have to sit for @ least 10 mins before i take off...
If you're driving any car made after 1990 then waiting TEN MINUTES before you drive it is doing nothing but putting holes in the ozone.

Seriously there is absolutely no need to wait this long. In fact, it is suboptimal.
tom10167 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-31-2010, 01:14 PM   #37
internationalballer
Senior Member
 
internationalballer's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 2,845
internationalballer is on a distinguished road
Default

I think he's talking about letting the car warm up so the heater is actually putting out warm air. You don't have to but its nice to wait for the heat when its -10 degrees out.
internationalballer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-31-2010, 11:45 PM   #38
soxOZ
Aussie Cruizer
 
soxOZ's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: The Best Place on the Planet...
Posts: 124
soxOZ is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingshead View Post
Contrary to popular belief the danger from running the oil too long isn't from metal paticles in the oil (the oil pan has a magnet installed for this purpose) it's carbon deposits. Carbon is what diamonds are constructed from and the individual particles are more abrasive than sandpaper. Since the carbon is not iron based the magnet will not attract these and will stay suspended in the oil. Some filters are better at removing these particles, but they very greatly in size and some will always pass through. The acid build up is another issue entirely, but this problem will also be addressed with frequent changes.

I've never been one to immediately drive off after starting, but I've also never waited for any prolonged amount of time either (usually about 20-30 seconds). I'm not really sure if this relates directly to bikes but I just like to give the oil pump enough time to lubricate the overhead cams on my high performance vehicles before creating higher rpm's. Just me.
I guess I generalized a little on stating “metal Particles” as this is usually more of a concern with new motors more than “carbon”, but you are correct in this analogy. Good point though you brought up about carbon....
But bike oil has additional requirements as it will not only lubricate and clean the engine of contamination but the transmission and clutch particles as well and all of this will need to be captured by either the filter or as you stated the magnetic drain plug. But transmission / clutch will shed more than the engine IMHO...
Anyway, without getting into a debate about all of this I think we all believe that using the correct oil and having regular maintenance is the way to go...

With all things considered there are basically only 2 factors effecting the time to start riding from cold start, “Lubrication of the engine” and “ride ability” of your bike...
And if all that is adhered to, well to me 20-30sec wait is basically considered riding off after starting, as usually just as you start your engine, most will do a few quick checks, like is the garage door closed behind you, your rear view mirrors are adjusted etc then start to ride, well I guess 20 second would have passed...
Bottom line is, if you’re happy with the cold start procedure you’re doing now and it works for you, just keep doing it as you’re the one that’s got to be happy about it... .

C.Ya...
Wally...
__________________
Wally...
2010 Honda Shadow Spirit VT750C2 FI...
soxOZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-31-2010, 11:57 PM   #39
David 1
Senior Member
 
David 1's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 1,459
David 1 will become famous soon enough
Default

Well, let me say my go forthwith is actually about 20 or 30 seconds. I may put on my other glove, if not already on, look both ways, put hands on bars, check all gauges, then, with caution, ride off.
If you want a car to warm up for the heater to work, drive it. It heats up faster and more efficiently that way.
dc
David 1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-01-2010, 02:47 AM   #40
Weebel
Banned

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Minnesota (it sucks)
Posts: 770
Weebel is on a distinguished road
Default

Guys.. in the winter time in some states, when you start your car the oil is so thick that you could stick a butter knife in it and it would stand straight up and stay there. Obviously your gunna need to let it warm up longer when its 20 below outside.

X2 on changing your oil more often cant hurt anything. I wouldnt go over 3 grand on anything I own, and I dont go over 2 grand on my bikes.

As for warming up sitting there... High idle on my ZX6R is 2 grand, but riding it you have to take off at 3 grand and never drop below that.. so obviously sitting and idling is easier on it not to mention there being less load put on the engine.

As for letting a bike sit and idle too long once its warmed up being bad for it thats true. Even liquid cooled bikes rely on air passing over the radiator from riding the bike to keep the engine cool, and most fans on bikes cant push enough air through the radiator to keep the temp where they should be on a hot day... "safe" ranges maybee, but usually not where its suppose to be. Air cooled bikes can actually have the engines damaged by sitting and idling to long... if you ever have to sit and wait for a train or something on a bike like that, your better off to just shut it off, and on a liquid cooled one with a gauge, keep an eye on the gauge if you leave it run.

I see people leave Harleys sitting in a driveway (after riding it there) idling at a rediculousley low rpm (just enough for it to run) for long periods of time... if they only knew that their bike was overheating, and the fact that a 600rpm might sound cool, it tears the crap out of the engine over time.
Weebel is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Thread Tools


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:36 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.