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Old 04-20-2012, 03:45 PM   #1
prider
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Default EITMS malfuction?

After 20,000 mile dealer service, my 2011 police model road king runs badly.
Unable to maintane forward motion in friction zone at slow speed, with loud noise. Even tho this was not a problem prior to service, after 3 returns to dealer they maintaine this is normal with 6 speed transmissions. After turning the EITMS on and off several times, the bike smoothed out, responce and comfort of riding improved.
Today after making several stops at different locations, the bike started running poorly.

My question is can the EITMS malfuction?

From the beginning with the EITMS engaged the bike performed poorly at any speed, so I never engaged this feature. As I understand the manuel this feature can be turned on or off by rolling the throtle forward with the start switch on but the motor off. It would seem to me that if you can turn this feature on or off then it is not automatic no matter the speed or temperature.
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Old 04-24-2012, 11:00 PM   #2
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Anything on a bike can malfunction, including the EITMS. There's no way I can diagnose your problem over the Internet, and in fact, if the bike was in front of me I couldn't help you much. This will require a DT-II which is available ONLY at a Harley dealership. Which one did you take it to?

One thing you can do to get an idea of what's going on though is to read any codes set by the ECM. You can do this without a DT-II and your manual will take you through the process step by step. Get the codes and maybe I can at least give you some intelligent talking points for when you take the bike in.

Another thing to ask for is to make sure they did all factory upgrades to the ECM. I seem to recall hearing that there was one for the EITMS, but I don't work with current bikes any more so I don't keep up with that. If the bike was hooked up to a DT-II last time it was in it SHOULD have automaticaly been updated, but it never hurts to ask and make sure.
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Old 04-28-2012, 09:38 PM   #3
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Default Thanks for input

Didn't get back sooner. Spent some miles trying to find a pattern. Then said what the heck and went to BikeFest in Leesburg.
There are no codes. I believe the EITMS is turning on and off.

The questions I cannot find a answer to remains.

Can the EITMS activate (by itself) and not turn off untill the motor is shut off, and if so will the bike run poorly?

When the bike is running this way the front cylinder is shaking but the rear one is not. The bike feels like it is just coming out of a lugging condition.

If the problem cannot be determined by HD computer connections will it showup on a DYNO test?
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Old 04-29-2012, 10:37 PM   #4
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Yes, the EITMS can activate by itself, but it's not supposed to when you're riding. And from what you describe that sounds like exactly what is happening. My guess is, and this is just a GUESS, is that you have a short in a control circuit wire somewhere, possibly in the hand control area.

Did you actualy check for stored codes or are you just saying that the check engine light did not come on?

The condition will be noticable on a dyno test as a loss in power and a hosed up AFR and so forth but that won't tell you anything about what's causing it and would be a waste of time. I think your best bet would be to take it to a dealer with a Master Tech. If it's not storing any codes it's going to take a set of wiring diagrams, a break-out box, a good multi-meter, and a lot of patience to find the short.
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Old 04-30-2012, 08:32 AM   #5
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Eye_m_no_angel;
Thanks for your input. There are no codes, I found the process and codes on the Internet from gwizit.com. Since this problem started I have spent hours on the bike trying to find a pattern or condition and unable to find any. My dealer doesn't seem to be concerned.
I guess my next step is to do some research on dealers in central Florida then give them the bike with the instruction fix it or keep it. I have so little faith in my dealer to give them this opporunity. I will not name the dealer untill I am able to determine that the problem is with the bike or my lack of experience or my imagination.

Incidently I spoke to another Dealer about the problem and they said, we will be glad to look at your bike and fix it because it is in warrenty; but if we find nothing wrong we will charge our hourly rate for labor.
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Old 04-30-2012, 09:52 AM   #6
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If yuo used the "light flash" method of checking for codes it won't always show any that are stored but not active. At any rate...

"they said, we will be glad to look at your bike and fix it because it is in warrenty; but if we find nothing wrong we will charge our hourly rate for labor"

That sounds effed up to me and I'm not sure they can do that. Why don't you call Harley directly, explain the problem to them, and ask for some help or guidance. Perhaps they can speak to the dealership for you or reccomend which one to take it to. (414) 343-4056 used to be the number. I'm sure they have an 800 number too that you could find on the Internet.
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Old 04-30-2012, 10:00 AM   #7
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As long as it is a persistent problem, and easily reproducible, there shouldn't be an issue of them not "finding" it.

Just to be safe, I would make sure you are there when they look at it and can demonstrate what is going on to the service manager. If they agree there is an issue but are unable to come up with a solution, you shouldn't be charged, since that is something different all together.
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Old 04-30-2012, 11:15 AM   #8
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Thanks all

Tried to contact HD Headquarters the only number they have is the one to arrange for a $10.00 tour of the museum. Tried the number from Eye_m_no_angel and reached a rep.

Had little or no interest in my problem; suggested I go to another dealer but had no info on a dealer that has a master tech. The only dealer I can find in a reasonable drive radius to where I live, is the one that will charge me for diagonstic.

According to HD Rep of course they can charge for the diagonstic service but
no one is going to ride the bike long enough to experience the problem. No responce to the query, what does a nontech with an non resolved problem such as this do.



So Thanks for the effort, I will find the problem then HD and I will become a bad memory.
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Old 04-30-2012, 02:17 PM   #9
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I'm surprised about the diagnostic charge, but different dealerships work different ways I guess.

As Dods indicated, they can't fix the problem if they can't find it.

And they can't find it if they don't have the bike.
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Old 04-30-2012, 05:04 PM   #10
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Hi
Not to belabor the point, but I have presented the bike for correction on not 1 but 3 different ocassions.

I sure have a lot to learn about bikes and related language.
Besides the obvious governmental and gaming meanings what does "Dods" mean when referring to bikes and or dealers?
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Old 04-30-2012, 06:53 PM   #11
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This is an intermittent problem, then? Are you able to reliably reproduce it?

That can make it tough to diagnose.
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Old 05-01-2012, 12:41 AM   #12
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"Dods" = Dodsfall. The above poster. Has nothing at all on this forum to do with the Department of Defence. (And I have no idea what it could relate to as far as gaming goes.)

Okay, if you bring a bike to an independant shop or dealership with an intermittant electrical problem, and it is not happening when you bring the bike in, and it doesn't happen when the technician test drives it, and there are no codes stored in the memory of the ECM, the chances are they cannot fix or repair it. This is true no matter what brand of bike you have.

From what you describe it sounds to me like there is a short in your control wire(s) for the EITMS. That is an educated guess based on my experience as a HD tech, but it is still just a GUESS.

See, unless the short is active when you bring the bike in, the only way a tech will be able to find it is to spend possibly countless hours tracing wires and checking each and every inch of wiring and each and every connection and plug. (And some of them are damm hard to get to.)

Okay, so what dealership did you take it to, and where are you located at? PM me if you don't feel comfortable posting that. There's a SLIGHT chance I might know someone at a dealership in your area that I can refer you too. But as Dods and I told you, if it isn't happening when you bring it in, it's still going to be damm hard to find.
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Old 05-01-2012, 09:35 AM   #13
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Once again thanks for the input.
Boy am I red faced I assumed that "dods" was an abbrivation for some part of the Harley Organization. I did not associate it with "dodsfall" a forum sign on.

I truly understand the cost and time in finding these types of problems as I spent some time repairing electronics. But I did not create the problem and I would think the dealer that sold and serviced the bike would be interested in having a satisfied customer.

I cannot create the problem on demand, but it will happen if the bike is riddden for more then 5 minutes.

Obviosuly I am upset and want to vent which does not solve the problem.
But also I am looking for info when I go back to a dealer.

I have searched the web for understanding the proper workings of HD throtle by wire and the EITMS where I feel the problem is coming from.

Basic question I cannot find out.
If I placed EITMS in the OFF mode first thing in the morning, then start and stop the bike. If I then go through the process to change the mode should the display not show On not Off? Wouldn't the fact that it displayed Off show that it had change itself? But perhaps I am looking in the wrong direction because no matter in what mode the EITMS is in the bike should run the same.
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Old 05-01-2012, 12:18 PM   #14
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I'm not sure I exactly understand your question, and do keep in mind I no longer work on these bikes so I'm not current, but basicaly what happens is once you activate or deactivate the EITMS it should stay in that mode regardless of how many times you turn the bike on or off. The excpetion is if you accidentaly turn it on or off by say, rolling the throttle all the way forward at a stop light and holding it without realizing it. I guess it could happen...

But no matter whether it's turned on or off, it's only supposed to operate when the bike is at idle, the transmission is in neutral or the clutch is in, the bike is not moving, and the cylinder head temperature is above a certain point. (I forget, maybe 300 degrees?) It should NOT activate when you're going down the road.
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Old 05-01-2012, 01:03 PM   #15
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Come to think of it, do you have an aftermarket fuel management system on there such as a Power Commander, Thunder Jet, Fuel Pak, or anything like that?
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Old 05-01-2012, 01:13 PM   #16
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Similar situation, different problem here. Hang in there and stay focused, these are the times that there is the most to learn.
Hope you find the problem/solution soon. All I have to offer is moral support.
Good Luck
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Old 05-12-2012, 09:42 AM   #17
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Sorry I have not gotten back sooner.

Gator Harley in Leesburg Fl. has solved my problem. It was in the throtle by wire. While I understand the concept I don't understand how it actualy works.
It seems there are "pins" (contacts) in the throtle grip that had worn down causing the bike to try and stay in idle state. Or at least that is the simplict expalnation they use to help me understand. However this may be a common problem.

Unfortunatly Crystal River Harley either have no experience with this posssible problem or just don't care. After 4 visits their answer was "that is the way all Harleys ride". My "special" bike now rides as it always has. All I fell are bumps in the road.

The reason is has taken me a while to say Thanks to those who responded is; it has been fun to ride again.
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