Why riders hate Hd ?

[Nova359]

Why others riders hate HD?
I dont understand it. For me MADE IN THE USA matters .Why we have to advise others subscriber to not to post in here? We dont use the same statement in Honda forumm, Kawasaki forum, etc. Why is people love HD or hate it?: nothing in between. Victory has the same engine in theirs bikes. Not for me for now. My next bike wil be HD no mater what.
Why I have to defend myself every time I said , my next bike will be a Harley Davidson? The oldest motorcycle manufactorer in the world.

Anybody has an anwser for this?:mad:

[CharlesW]

No answers here.
I wasn't aware that HDs were hated by other riders.
One of my best friends and regular riding partner rides Harleys.
He has a 2008 Sportster XL1200R and a 2009 Sportster XR1200.
They are just motorcycles. No hate on my part.
FWIW, I have a couple of Hondas.

[CaptCrashIdaho]

This is an age old motorcycle problem that appears to have no workable solutions. The HD v. Other Brands is an unsolvable problem. It's about personal taste and personal values. The best you can hope for is a quiet truce.

For sports see:

Red Sox v. Yankees
Cowboys v. Redskins
Dodgers v. Giants
Michigan v. Ohio State
Cal v. Stanford

For food see:

Salsa v. ketchup (on eggs)
Mustard v. ketchup (on hot dogs)
Frozen Custard v. Ice Cream (and really? They're the same thing)

Automobiles:

Ford v. Chevy
Porsche v. Ferrari
BMW v. Mercedes

People like what they like--your time is better spend enjoying the things you like rather than worrying about what other people want or like.

[MikeK77]

I don't think it's a "hate on HD"...

I think it's more on the "hate on the HD rider"

I can't speak for everywhere, but where I am, most HD riders have that "It's either HD, or nothing" attitude. Too many times I get looked down on because I have a Suzuki. I once got told "you don't have the right to park next to my HD"...REALLY???

If Im at a light, and a HD comes next to me, I'll greet him, be friendly...I won't get a peep, or even a look from him. It's amazing.

[Dodsfall]

I don't think it's a "hate on HD"...

I think it's more on the "hate on the HD rider"

I can't speak for everywhere, but where I am, most HD riders have that "It's either HD, or nothing" attitude. Too many times I get looked down on because I have a Suzuki. I once got told "you don't have the right to park next to my HD"...REALLY???

If Im at a light, and a HD comes next to me, I'll greet him, be friendly...I won't get a peep, or even a look from him. It's amazing.

There are a lot of idiots in the world. There are a few who buy into the hype (and advertising) that the motorcycle defines the rider. Believing that most HD owners can be lumped into a single group of "HD or nothing" is pretty silly. Although the jerks might stand out more, there are many more who are just regular people who like to ride.

[markk53]

Why others riders hate HD?
I dont understand it. For me MADE IN THE USA matters .Why we have to advise others subscriber to not to post in here? We dont use the same statement in Honda forumm, Kawasaki forum, etc. Why is people love HD or hate it?: nothing in between. Victory has the same engine in theirs bikes. Not for me for now. My next bike wil be HD no mater what.
Why I have to defend myself every time I said , my next bike will be a Harley Davidson? The oldest motorcycle manufactorer in the world.

Anybody has an anwser for this?:mad:

It isn't the bikes, it's the attitude some have.

If made in the USA mattered, you'd have considered Honda a brother in arms for years. You see, much of the equipment on them was manufactured in the U.S. until recently when they made the decision to turn all of their facilities that did motorcycles to automobile manufacturing. They quit building the bikes here, but they didn't cut the jobs and close the plants. Plus Honda and others doing some of their work here brought in the parts that are used on Harleys now. Showa in Sunbury Ohio makes the forks and shocks for Harleys, Showa is a Honda subsidiary. Nissin may also have manufacturing here in the U.S. too, making the brakes for Hondas and Harleys along with cars too. The Japanese manufacturers have helped the U.S. manufacturers indirectly as well as directly by demonstrating manufacturing processes.

But you'd never know that by some HD owners' attitudes. I remember one guy looking at my old hotrodded Yamaha SR500 single, with his comment about Jap crap. The thing that was really disgusting was that I also knew him and knew he started out on Japanese bikes and one of his streetbikes was an H1 Kaw triple. Nice attitude.

Then there are the guys I really like. One owns three HDs and a few metrics, the other is exclusive HD, but both acknowledge an appreciation for Japanese bikes. Both rode and raced them, they just prefer the Harleys now for their riding. No problem, you can carry on a conversation with them about bikes in general. No insults no "when ya gettin' a real bike" from them. They KNOW.

By the way, Harley is the oldest continous manufacturer, but Triumph is actually the oldest, starting a few years before HD. There was a few years down time before the new Triumph started up again. It wasn't bantered about like Indian or Norton. They went out and a few years later sold out and started up again. Even Harley got sold out twice. Which could make BMW the oldest sole survivor in the motorcycle manufacturing business, having not been sold out before. So you can make your statement with confidence by saying "the oldest continuous maker of motorcycles" and be prepared for any questioning of that statement. One other side note, the HD wasn't the first V-twin built, there were a few others. But again the longest continuous maker of V-twins.

Keep a good attitude toward all and push back at any beraters of any brand. That's my way. Even when selling Hondas in the 80s, after the Evos came out and were on the road for a few years, we knew they had a good bike. We weren't afraid to tell those who propagated the myths about them, that the myths weren't true, but we also weren't afraid to compare our bikes to them either. A rational sale went our way, an emotion based sale went theirs. A number of times I had people looking at bikes who said they really wanted a Harley, I kind of said "why are you here?" letting them know that they should buy what they want. Still do.

If you can admire a metric you may find the metric rider can admire your HD. It's all about mutual respect. Heck you even see the rift within the Motor Company product, riders of the big twins who feel the Sportster isn't "a real bike". And don't even ask those guys about Buells. Attitude...

[als2052]

And BTW, about 60% of HD bikes are american made...remaining 40% is asian and europian parts...

[Dodsfall]

And BTW, about 60% of HD bikes are american made...remaining 40% is asian and europian parts...

Statistics like these are complete fabrications 98.765% of the time.

[MikeK77]

Statistics like these are complete fabrications 98.765% of the time.

But they are fun 115% of the time:thumbsup:

[4Raven]

It isn't a hatred of the HD....like other's said, it is their attitude that some have that they are better than someone else because they ride a HD....to me....who the hell cares??? You ride what you ride and you enjoy it and should love to see others enjoy the same sport!:wink:

I have HD boots and I buy Brian HD stuff at HD stores when I am out riding around the countryside....even their clothes are overpriced though!

[Badlands-4-2]

:biggrin:If you really want to confuse people do like I did today. Put on your leather HD jacket with a big logo on the back and ride your Kawasaki.

You can find people that hate, anything. I pay them no mind. My mind is to busy enjoying things.

[curtis41]

Both my sons have or had Harley Davidsons. The older son sold his HD Fat Boy 2004 for a 2012 BMW R1200RT. He said the main reason is the bike was not comfortable on longer trips and the solid wheels made him drift quite a bit in strong crosswinds where he rides most of the time. The other son has (still has) his 883 Sportster and found it not suitable for longer trips and for two up riding. He bought a mint Triumph Tiger triple 955i for $6300 with under 10k on the odometer and plans to sell his Sportster. He also bought his wife a new bike and my younger son still takes the Triumph Tiger when they ride together. Other riders ride Harleys and never any other brand of bike. Truth be told, there are some really good, fairly reliable bikes to choose from and they are getting better and better every year for the most part. Whatever bike you choose, enjoy the ride and ride safely. I am not much on criticising other riders' choice of bikes. There is already enough of that going around, and criticism just adds to the heat, and not the light, for the many reasons riders pick a particular bike.

[markk53]

That makes me think of what my brother did. He went from his 1990 VFR750 Interceptor, considered the best sport touring bike every year of its existence and went to a Buell Ulysses. His wife finds that seat and the integral backrest/rack to be far more comfortable than the Interceptor seat - and that's saying a lot.

You know that is part of the problem with some of the Harleys, like the big twin customs, they aren't that great for the open road rider. The dressers certainly are though, because there is no sacrifice for "the look". We used to have a couple of guys stop in at the Honda shop. They had the big Harleys, but obviously the wrong ones. They also had older Gold Wings, and told us the Wings were for the long rides, the Harleys were for the cruises and looks. I'm thinking one was a Fat Boy, but I don't remember what the other was. Neither was one of the real touring versions.

I guess if you can afford it, why not play. One friend has his SR500, a Sportster tricked out with the Storz XR stuff including high pipes, one of the custom looking big inch twin Soft tails for cruising with his wife, and his late father's 1972 dresser Harley. The 72 has a bunch of miles on it, looks perfect, and is on it's second paint job - seems his father cleaned and polished through the original paint! All good, all nice.

[V8Thrasher]

It isn't a hatred of the HD....like other's said, it is their attitude that some have that they are better than someone else because they ride a HD....to me....who the hell cares??? You ride what you ride and you enjoy it and should love to see others enjoy the same sport!:wink:

I have HD boots and I buy Brian HD stuff at HD stores when I am out riding around the countryside....even their clothes are overpriced though!

How much you pay for those boots Raven o.O the ones I want are $400 :eek: the damn plaid shirts are like $50 $60 :o

[4Raven]

Oh I think they were $100-125, but they held up, over 22K miles, the last pair I bought were more expensive than that, but I think they look nicer...
Have to see how long they last...

[MikeK77]

I bet if you rip off that HD emblem, you can sell that on ebay...lol

[4Raven]

I bet if you rip off that HD emblem, you can sell that on ebay...lol

:coffeescreen: Ouch! :coffeescreen:

[goalie]

I ride na sportster 48 and love it. My two regular riding buddies ride a Honda and a BMW. We tease one another's choice in bikes all the time, but the only "disdain" I've actually heard about another brand has come from only two sources -- and only infrequently: some rice rocket riders who hate anything else, particularly HD and ... some HD owners I've met who think nothing else is a real bike. I ignore both groups.

[OTD]

It isn't a hatred of the HD....like other's said, it is their attitude that some have that they are better than someone else because they ride a HD....to me....who the hell cares??? You ride what you ride and you enjoy it and should love to see others enjoy the same sport!:wink:

I have HD boots and I buy Brian HD stuff at HD stores when I am out riding around the countryside....even their clothes are overpriced though!

See I never encountered any of these guys in person when I had my Honda. Now I did have people yell "Get a Harley." on a couple of occasions. But neither of them were on bikes.
I ride with the same folks now that I rode with when I had a Honda and they ride Harley's. It was riding their bikes that convinced me to get rid of my less than comfortable VTX.
Like my sig says I really don't care what you ride though.:icon_cool:

[4Raven]

I have actually encountered people who will not even talk to you because you are not riding a HD! The group of riders that I met down south this year, while riding by myself, were absolutely the most friendly I had ever had the pleasure to meet...they were all on GWs...we had a great time at the restaurant ....they had invited me to eat dinner with them...and we sat there for hours laughing and having fun!

I am not saying that they are all like that...but I have never met anyone that rode something else other than a HD that wouldn't wave or say hello. I have friends that ride HD...but it always seems as though they are "threatened" and also trying to defend their bikes hmmm....maybe that is it...

[Eye_m_no_angel]

And BTW, about 60% of HD bikes are american made...remaining 40% is asian and europian parts...

12 to 16% of the parts used in Harley Davidson's are made over seas, not 40%

[cbdallas]

I don't hate them...I just have no use for them. On more than a few occasions I've ended up beside a HD at a stoplight, and they were vibrating so badly it appeared as if the engine was trying to escape the frame. Clearly the owners enjoy this, but why that's enjoyable is a mystery to me. I've owned nothing but Japanese bikes, and when a friend asked me to ride her Sportster to the shop for her one day a few years ago, I encountered NOTHING about the bike that I found enjoyable. Loud, uncomfortable, not particularly powerful considering the size of the engine, and of questionable build quality. It just takes a certain type of person to appreciate a HD. I'm just not one of them. But Hate? That word doesn't apply.

[goalie]

I don't hate them...I just have no use for them. ...and when a friend asked me to ride her Sportster to the shop for her one day a few years ago, I encountered NOTHING about the bike that I found enjoyable. Loud, uncomfortable, not particularly powerful considering the size of the engine, and of questionable build quality. It just takes a certain type of person to appreciate a HD. I'm just not one of them. But Hate? That word doesn't apply.

"Of questionable build quality???" I'm not sure what you base that statement on, but that is what I do notice on many forums -- statements thrown out just for the sake of it. My personal experience and based upon my own research (which could be seriously flawed, but I do not think so), HD has quite high build quality. Every review, ezine article, trusted mechanic I've come across has not dissed the build quality of HD.

When it comes to pulling up at traffic lights, my non-HD buddies will sometimes rev their engines (Honda and BMW). Even they admit the sound of my sportster is much more pleasing to the ear. Anecdotal, I know, but just as valid as your remark.

[cbdallas]

As far as cosmetic build quality, I will admit they are top notch. But when it comes to reliability, they're not exactly top of the heap. I have several family members who own a HD, as well as the aformentioned female friend and her husband, and there's ALWAYS something going wrong with their bikes. My friend's husband's bike is on a lift more than its on the road...He's replaced a gasket twice on the primary since I've known him. My brother's has been down for the count 3 times this year, including stranding him at the Destin, FL rally this summer. His have all been very expensive fixes, including a completely new throttle body last spring.

I've owned 8 Japanese bikes since 1991 and my issues have been comparatively minor. My biggest expense to date has been tires. The '81 Yamaha was a garage rescue that didn't even end up needing carb work after sitting for 3 years. Not even an oil leak.

Pleasing sounds are definitely a subjective matter.

[zmago]

Different strokes for different folks. Back in 1981 I had no use for two strokes until a friend let me take his RD350LC for a spin. I didn't have the money for one, so I bought an RD400 instead, and had great fun on it.

I never considered a Harley until I took the XR1200 for a test drive, and it was such fun, I bought it. I know there are faster, lighter, smaller, bigger, more comfortable, older, newer, etc. bikes around, but I like this one.

My cousin let me take his Kawasaki Z1000 for a spin. Great bike! I'd be happy to own one, but don't have room for another bike in my garage. I know he could beat me in a race, but that's not why I ride a bike. Now where can I get a doo rag? ;)

[Hopper]

I don't hate them...I just have no use for them. On more than a few occasions I've ended up beside a HD at a stoplight, and they were vibrating so badly it appeared as if the engine was trying to escape the frame. Clearly the owners enjoy this, but why that's enjoyable is a mystery to me. I've owned nothing but Japanese bikes, and when a friend asked me to ride her Sportster to the shop for her one day a few years ago, I encountered NOTHING about the bike that I found enjoyable. Loud, uncomfortable, not particularly powerful considering the size of the engine, and of questionable build quality. It just takes a certain type of person to appreciate a HD. I'm just not one of them. But Hate? That word doesn't apply.

If you came up behind me on open road, i would take the right lane and wave you by, If I met you on the road, I would wave, If I saw you at the gas pump we would talk, but if you pulled up beside me at a light, I would not speak to you because you just invaded my 'space' and I don't know you from Adam and it would not matter if you are on a Harley, a metric or a Moped. Maybe 'they' or their 'brand' of bike is not the problem.
Just say'in
:icon_cool:
Stay safe, maybe we will meet up sometime, we live in your area.
Black and Rootbeer HD Softails trying to stay less than 10 mph over speed limit, don't need a ticket.

[OTD]

How much you pay for those boots Raven o.O the ones I want are $400 :eek: the damn plaid shirts are like $50 $60 :o

Academy sports sells some Harley brand boots and most pairs are right at $100-$150. I got lucky, a friend of mine had a pair of Mega-Conductors that were too tight that He had only worn once. Since I let him use one of my lifts every once in a while he gave em' to me.

Amazon has them for 154.95.

[OTD]

12 to 16% of the parts used in Harley Davidson's are made over seas, not 40%

I think they get this kind of info from the kool-aid that you get at metric dealers when you're bike shopping.
And probably even the cofee.

[goalie]

As far as cosmetic build quality, I will admit they are top notch. But when it comes to reliability, they're not exactly top of the heap. I have several family members who own a HD, as well as the aformentioned female friend and her husband, and there's ALWAYS something going wrong with their bikes. My friend's husband's bike is on a lift more than its on the road...He's replaced a gasket twice on the primary since I've known him. My brother's has been down for the count 3 times this year, including stranding him at the Destin, FL rally this summer. His have all been very expensive fixes, including a completely new throttle body last spring.

I've owned 8 Japanese bikes since 1991 and my issues have been comparatively minor. My biggest expense to date has been tires. The '81 Yamaha was a garage rescue that didn't even end up needing carb work after sitting for 3 years. Not even an oil leak.

Pleasing sounds are definitely a subjective matter.

Please do not take this the wrong way, but if all of these friends and family members are having so many problems with HD's, why are they still buying them?

I'm not about to say any bike is built "better" than everyone else's bike. ...But I have yet to see anything reputable comparison of major bike co's that show that HD or Honda or Yamaha, etc., are "lesser" build quality.

[markk53]

They might actually be motorcycle hypochondriacs! Always think something is wrong. I hear all the fables about the Harley reliability issues with the Evo and newer, but just haven't seen it in fact among anyone I know with Harleys. I will believe it if I was told things vibrate off and such, it happens with the big bore metric cruisers too.

[Mickey3696]

Iv never liked just one company over another rather it be cars, trucks, or bikes but I will say I LOVE riding my Harley. I have rode a few Hondas and never felt right on it but the first time I got on my Sportster It felt like it was made just for me. I catch heck all the time for my Tundra from all they Ford and Chevy people. I tell them they ALL have problems its just what works for you!

If we were all ment to ride Harleys then there wouldn't be a need for other dealers!! Enjoy your OWN ride!!

[cbdallas]

If you came up behind me on open road, i would take the right lane and wave you by, If I met you on the road, I would wave, If I saw you at the gas pump we would talk, but if you pulled up beside me at a light, I would not speak to you because you just invaded my 'space' and I don't know you from Adam and it would not matter if you are on a Harley, a metric or a Moped. Maybe 'they' or their 'brand' of bike is not the problem.
Just say'in
:icon_cool:
Stay safe, maybe we will meet up sometime, we live in your area.
Black and Rootbeer HD Softails trying to stay less than 10 mph over speed limit, don't need a ticket.

Just to clarify, I was the passenger in a car during these encounters, sitting one lane over. I'd never pull my bike up next to another bike in the same lane. Careful in Murphy...544 between Racetrac and Brand Rd. is a total speed trap.

[Eye_m_no_angel]

"My friend's husband's bike is on a lift more than its on the road...He's replaced a gasket twice on the primary since I've known him."

:Gasp:

No kidding, you replace the primary gasket each time you replace the primary oil, which is best done each time you replace the engine oil. I replace a primary gasket on my woman's bike every 5k miles, or 3-4 times a year.

[cbdallas]

"My friend's husband's bike is on a lift more than its on the road...He's replaced a gasket twice on the primary since I've known him."

:Gasp:

No kidding, you replace the primary gasket each time you replace the primary oil, which is best done each time you replace the engine oil. I replace a primary gasket on my woman's bike every 5k miles, or 3-4 times a year.

I must have misunderstood what was leaking oil on his garage floor...but I swear he said primary. But regardless, what company that takes any pride in theur product requires a gasket change at every OCI? Kinda proves my point

Oh...and :Gasp:

[Eye_m_no_angel]

I think they get this kind of info from the kool-aid that you get at metric dealers when you're bike shopping.
And probably even the cofee.

Probably.

"All Harley's leak oil, break down, vibrate, aren't reliable, are made in China..." etc., etc., etc. These comments are almost always from people that have never owned a Harley, probably never ridden one, and certainly have never worked on them. If it were 40 years ago I might have agreed with them, (other then the China part,) but that's a whole different matter.

30 years ago I had a 1972 Honda, that was a POS, mostly because it was worn out by people, including myself, who didn't have the money, or skill, to keep it running and maintained correctly. So now I'm supposed to get on a forum and post judgements about ALL Hondas made today? That would be idiotic and immature.

I don't post stuff about metrics because I don't know much about them, and taking a brief ride really doesn't give me enough to base an opinion on. Not enough to post detracting statements anyway. If I have a real, factual basis of knowledge, sure, I'll post an opinion, but you'll never see me denigrate another person's ride on here. I have no need to.

[Eye_m_no_angel]

"I must have misunderstood what was leaking oil on his garage floor...but I swear he said primary. But regardless, what company that takes any pride in theur product requires a gasket change at every OCI? Kinda proves my point"

Which kind of proves my point, above. You make statements about bikes that you clearly know very little about. For that matter, why did you even click on a thread entitled "Harley Davidson" if you don't have any use for them?

Harley's now are designed to NOT change the primary gasket with each primary oil change. What you change is the derby cover o-ring. They have made such improvements in quality and design that it is no longer needed to remove the primary cover and inspect the chain and chain tension until, I think, the 50,000 mile mark. On older Harley's, that was a pretty good idea.

As for your friend's leaking bike...<chuckle>...What year is it? That would make a difference. I'll assume his bike was made before 1984, or that his mechanical abilities aren't what he makes his living from, because if you replace the primary gasket with an updated one, it won't leak. (IF you replace the gasket correctly, which many people do not.)

[cbdallas]

Harley's now are designed to NOT change the primary gasket with each primary oil change.

You're going to have to make up your mind which it is before an appropriate response can be provided.

Previously posted:

"No kidding, you replace the primary gasket each time you replace the primary oil, which is best done each time you replace the engine oil."


I apologize if my opinions have inflamed you such that you're no longer paying attention to what you're posting, but instead are focusing singly on proving me wrong. The title of the thread is not "Harley Davidson", it's "Why Riders Hate HD". I came in because I wanted to 1) see why anyone would actually HATE them, and 2) explain that those of us who are not HD fans don't harbor any "hate". No, I don't know everything there is to know about how a HD is put together, simply because I don't agree with what seems an overly-complicated design philosophy. I've had no real reason to look into them because I have no desire to own one. The only information I have is derived from the experiences passed on to me by family and friends. I have owned bikes that require valve clearance checks / adjustments periodically, which is the price you pay to have OHC engines. But they don't leak, (or mine haven't anyway) and with minimal care, they don't break. Everything's a compromise...I just don't find the compromises within HD ownership to be acceptable because of what I've been told about them.

To address Goalie's question: My brother is a retired Ford Truck Plant union worker with 30 years put in. He'd sooner take a bullet than own anything Japanese. He worked in an environment where employees who own Fords were allowed to park in the parking lot right next to the factory, where those that drove Dodges, Chevys or anything imported were forced to park in a remote parking lot a good distance from the plant. He doesn't have any other reason than that...Japanese bikes & cars bad....domestic good. He always refers to my bikes and cars as "rice grinders", even when his HD is in pieces. Because of his deeply engrained, yet unfounded opinions, he contines to buy HDs and Fords. *eyeroll*

My uncle has the same opinion about imports, even though he's currently driving a Navigator that has stranded him 5 hours from home with transmission fluid spewed all over I-75 in Atlanta. He has some huge Harley that he won't even take on a 130 mile road trip to see his daughter because he's unwilling to be stranded somewhere. My friend and his wife are die-hard Harley fans, but have yet to give me a reason why they refuse to own anything else. She, however, drives a Mitsubishi Outlander.

All I have to go from is other people's experiences, which causes me to shy away from HD, as well as Volkswagen, and old Jaguars. VW has a horrible reputation for quality and customer service, and I have friends and one co-worker that have been through the minefield with them. Pre-Ford Jaguars are known the world over for having nightmarish electrical systems. So wouldn't I be a little crazy (or brave) to buy either, after the experiences I've heard and read about?

The question was about people who hate HD. I just don't think anyone hates them. Maybe the riders, but hating a bike would be silly, even if you don't agree with it's design.

[OTD]

First impressions mean a lot. I talked crap about Harley for the longest time because my first was a Sporster and it was a complete piece of crap. But I attempt to buy American whenever possible. Add that to the fact that 200 miles seemed like a long day of riding on my VTX and I quickly started to look elsewhere.
My riding buddies ride Harley and none of them were having problems so I test rode a couple of their bikes. The VTX felt like a plastic toy compared to the Road King and I couldn't/wouldn't even consider a Goldwing because of their Butt-A$$ ugly looks.
I love my Ultra and I'm glad I looked past my first impression. But I'm sure the Wing rider loves his bike it just ain't my cup-o-tea. And no way have I missed my VTX even a small bit.
And while you don't agree with the design of the Harley, I couldn't and don't see many Sportbike riders touring. I'm 47 and after 600 miles I can get off hit the sack and I'm not sore the next day at all.

I'm not attacking CB just stating my side as congenial as I can.

[markk53]

First impressions mean a lot. I talked crap about Harley for the longest time because my first was a Sporster and it was a complete piece of crap. But I attempt to buy American whenever possible. Add that to the fact that 200 miles seemed like a long day of riding on my VTX and I quickly started to look elsewhere.
My riding buddies ride Harley and none of them were having problems so I test rode a couple of their bikes. The VTX felt like a plastic toy compared to the Road King and I couldn't/wouldn't even consider a Goldwing because of their Butt-A$$ ugly looks.
I love my Ultra and I'm glad I looked past my first impression. But I'm sure the Wing rider loves his bike it just ain't my cup-o-tea. And no way have I missed my VTX even a small bit.
And while you don't agree with the design of the Harley, I couldn't and don't see many Sportbike riders touring. I'm 47 and after 600 miles I can get off hit the sack and I'm not sore the next day at all.

I'm not attacking CB just stating my side as congenial as I can.

You actually have to look for them. They don't have a bill board up saying "I'm touring". And besides that, not all bikes with bags and fairings are "touring". I'd venture to bet 90% or more of the bikes with bags one sees on the road are NOT touring. They're likely on a day ride or less. That's simply how bikes are used for the most part.

The other thing is few sportbike riders will seek the kind of roads some dresser is running. We have done a number of day or two overnighters goofing around both on dual sports and sport/naked bike rides. We purposly stay off the slabs. Our time in the saddle will not be cruising at the posted limit on some open road, it will be on the nastiest road for the bike we have. Aka, the tightest windingest road with a decent surface on the sport/naked bikes and also when playing supermoto on the dualsport/supermotos, or virtually anything legal to be ridden on the dual sports, regardless of surface condition. We do that with softbags on the roadbikes and with backpacks or even trailering to an area to do the dual sport stuff. Our overnighters may only involve a back pack and a credit card for "credit card camping" at the local motel wherever we end up.

So one can not simply assume that every sport rider isn't "touring" if they have soft bags/boxes or even a back pack, nor can one assume that every rider of a bike with bags on it is touring. Unless one actually coverses with a rider they really don't know. Heck, I went on a 500 mile run with just a back pack strapped to the seat of my old 400 triple back in 75, going up to the Macinaw Straits area of Michigan to be with family. Shipped dirty clothes home before too, when on a trip to allow some room for other stuff in the box on the way home.

Regardless, the point is not everyone hates Harleys as well as every Harley rider not hating metrics. But there are the exceptions for sure. The rumor mongers and those who compare apples to oranges from both owner groups.

[OTD]

Yeah, I'm talking true sportbikes like CB rides. He!! Mike still rides a CB360 touring but that isn't the norm. The point I'm trying to make is pretty clear. I rode to yellowstone and back and saw 5 times more Harley's at motels (That's a rough estimate don't ask for data as I was there I didn't take pictures.) Than all other bikes combined.

[V8Thrasher]

Academy sports sells some Harley brand boots and most pairs are right at $100-$150. I got lucky, a friend of mine had a pair of Mega-Conductors that were too tight that He had only worn once. Since I let him use one of my lifts every once in a while he gave em' to me.

Amazon has them for 154.95.

Thank you OTD, I'll look into them.

[V8Thrasher]

Idk if my input applies here because I have a Night Rod Special and I know a lot of HD guys don't like to include them in their circles (especially the Road King guys lol) but that was my first Harley, and im completely in love with it. Its such a smooth ride, it's fast, revs high, and looks good doing it. It's been very dependable to date no problems at all yet no leaky oil nothing. When I ride it people always state because I guess they've never seen it before? I remember 2 weeks ago I was yielding to make a left turn and a sportsbike rider on the opposite side f the street was making a right and he looked and waved to me, which was pretty cool. I've seen other Harley riders when I ride and none have so much as bothered to look at my bike. It's like they know it's a v rod and reuse to look at it. But anyways I'm very happy with my bike, it's a Harley, I don't wear a Half helmet or a patched up t shirt when I ride , I dont agree with the whole "life style" crap they have going on but one thing I know is I love my '12 Night Rod Special

[baba booey]

I've been impressed by the fit and finish of the current model HDs. I am in the market for a cruiser and have been looking at all avenues. I've owned ATVs and PWCs from all the major Japanese manufactures (great machines). There is just something that I can't explain that keeps drawing me to HD.

[V8Thrasher]

There is just something that I can't explain that keeps drawing me to HD.

Same thing with me, I was looking at the M109R, Midnight Warrior, Honda Vulcan, even the Ducati Diavel and Streetfighter, and Triumph Street Triple R, but Harley's especially the Night Rod Special just attracted me(but I am saving for a used Italian Sportbike or Streetfighter shhh ;p )

[MikeK77]

SOOOOO....

Today Im on a nice ride...Im on a highway, I see a bike in front of me, that I happen to be catching on to. Im behind him for a little bit until I got tired of traffic passing me, so I happen to pass him. I did it at a somewhat slow pace, to take a look at the bike, and wait for a head turn to give him the whole "head nod" greeting....

DBag on a HD wouldn't even turn his head to acknowledge I was there, even though I was next to him for a good 30secs. So i basically did the "F U, throttle roll, leave in dust" move"

[CharlesW]

SOOOOO....

Today Im on a nice ride...Im on a highway, I see a bike in front of me, that I happen to be catching on to. Im behind him for a little bit until I got tired of traffic passing me, so I happen to pass him. I did it at a somewhat slow pace, to take a look at the bike, and wait for a head turn to give him the whole "head nod" greeting....

DBag on a HD wouldn't even turn his head to acknowledge I was there, even though I was next to him for a good 30secs. So i basically did the "F U, throttle roll, leave in dust" move"
You probably won't feel a lot of love if you ride next to my Honda for a good 30 seconds.

[MikeK77]

You probably won't feel a lot of love if you ride next to my Honda for a good 30 seconds.

I was sitting next to him waiting for a "hey how ya doing" acknowledgment. But typical HD rider ignoring a metric.

[baba booey]

I'm sure there are plenty of unfriendly people on metric bikes as well.

[Maggie]

So help me on this one....Is it "illegal" to ride up beside another bike at a stop light? Or is this some sort of "unspoken male code"? I've had cars pull up beside me at a light. This pissed me off. But if you're on a bike it seems like there is more than enough room...
I've seen others do it. I "assumed" it was OK. ???

[Nitelord]

I have nothing against HD or HD riders. My neighbor and I ride together a good bit.
Used to be his HD and me on the Ninja. Maybe he will let me lead now that I have a cruiser. :wink: Just kidding. We have always gotten along fine. However, I have to admit, he always gets a wave from another HD rider, I get ignored. I can't explain it. Just seems to be the norm.

On the other hand, he would get dissed by sportbike riders and they would return my wave. I guess it goes both ways.

[CharlesW]

So help me on this one....Is it "illegal" to ride up beside another bike at a stop light? Or is this some sort of "unspoken male code"? I've had cars pull up beside me at a light. This pissed me off. But if you're on a bike it seems like there is more than enough room...
I've seen others do it. I "assumed" it was OK. ???
While it's not illegal, I don't do it to anyone I don't know just out of respect for "their space".

FWIW, MikeK77 was referring to passing someone and riding alongside of them for 30 seconds. That's a lot different than being alongside someone stopped at a light.

Personally, I wouldn't do it stopped or on the move.
That certainly doesn't mean I'm right.

I also don't pass another bike in the same lane. I give them the same lane clearance I would give a car.

[4Raven]

When I ride along with people I know personally, we automatically pull up alongside each other at the lights, usually to bs or give each other info....otherwise I never pull up next to someone I don't know..out of respect for their space...I consider the area on both sides of my bike to be mine to use...especially in an emergency...;)

[MikeK77]

FWIW, MikeK77 was referring to passing someone and riding alongside of them for 30 seconds. That's a lot different than being alongside someone stopped at a light.

Personally, I wouldn't do it stopped or on the move.
That certainly doesn't mean I'm right.

I also don't pass another bike in the same lane. I give them the same lane clearance I would give a car.

It was 2 lanes same direction highway....wasn;t like I was in ongoing traffic or sharring a lane.

[Hopper]

Rode metrics for thirty years and got the 'cold' treatment some folks on Harleys ( won't call them riders). Now I ride a Harley and get the same from some folks on metrics. Have decided that the brand of bike has nothing to do with it, it is the egos riding them. If they don't want to wave or acknowledge, that is fine with me, it is none of my business what they think of me or my bike anyway. I have fun riding and no one's opinion is going to take away from that.
Bless them on their way and may their eyes be more open than their mind.

[zmago]

I wave at everything on two wheels. It's only scooter riders who won't wave back. When someone on a bike doesn't wave back, I figure he or she is probably preoccupied with something else.

Of course, there's probably posts on some forums somewhere saying "Guess what? Some *ssh*l* on a Harley waved at me today! :mad:"

[goalie]

So help me on this one....Is it "illegal" to ride up beside another bike at a stop light? Or is this some sort of "unspoken male code"? I've had cars pull up beside me at a light. This pissed me off. But if you're on a bike it seems like there is more than enough room...
I've seen others do it. I "assumed" it was OK. ???

If cars pull up next to you in the same lane that you are occupying, you must be too far to the right. I always occupy the middle of the lane or left tire track of any lane when riding alone.

When I ride with friends, we never ride alongside of one another. It's just too dangerous. Heck, if someone rode next to me for 30 seconds, I'd be a little annoyed.

With friends, we often pull up next to one another at lights or stop signs. This enables us to clear the intersections quicker and as a unit. That being said, that's a total of 3-4 riders. I've never ridden in a larger group.

I wave to everyone. One of the best things about riding is being friendly.

[markk53]

Well, you were a bit all encompassing with your statement. I would not disagree with the fact that there are going to be more tourers on the road. That just makes sense. There are more tourers at the motels than the more custom oriented ones too.

You get in the right area and you're going to see it. I guarantee you will see sportbikes doing the long haul at a lot of roadraces - along with Harleys of all sorts. Most sportbike and naked bike riders ride to races, they don't just go out for a tour.

It's kind of like me saying I never see any Harleys on the dirt/gravel back roads we ride. That is both sort of misleading and also false. The misleading part is that there aren't really any Harleys built to do the dirt/gravel thing. Then the false part is some riders do ride those roads, intentionally or not... we have stopped by a few riders who got on them by mistake and ask us what's ahead. We tell them if it's not a big deal or if it's gonna look ugly for them and they should turn around. I'm sure there are some guys with either older Sportsters or "Italy-Davidsons" that play around. In addition, there is the Buell Ulysses too. My brother has one.

I will say usually there is some good conversation at motels at the end of the day when there are riders who actually make a bit of effort to socialize with other riders. We always enjoyed that. Part of the fun at various races and such.

One thing I will definitely credit a lot of Harley riders with is their support of motorcycle racing (actually all types). You go to virtually any races and you're going to see a fair number of Harleys, be it motocross, roadracing, or dirt track. A lot of Harley riders are race fanatics. Those guys at the MX and road races are also the ones who are true motorcycle enthusiasts. The Harleys don't have much in the field to cheer about, except for the formula races that are exclusive to the brand. But those guys aren't there for just those races, they were there when there wasn't any HD formula races.

As much as I can complain about Harley having too much influence on the AMA Pro Racing Grand National series, that's the AMA and whatever lobbies, not the race fans. The race fans want to see a close race with their favorites winning, not a freight train of the same thing. I didn't like it when the Yamaha TZ750 won all the AMA Formula 1 races back in the day and I didn't care for it when Mladin was winning everything on the GSXR in the recent past. I didn't like it how the XR750 has won everything (along with being nearly the entire field) in dirt track. I want to see them run close races, like the 600 Supersports and the 450 flat track series. Mladin had it down to him and his team and that was life, but when a whole field is virtually one bike and no one can get competitive there is a problem.

But that's a rant. Suffice it to say I like some banter, but in the end I like people who like all bikes. The kind of people who would ride a stinking moped if it was the last thing on two wheels. The ones who can look at someone's bike that isn't their style and still appreciate either the work or the owner's pride. When a rider can't give appreciation for another's ride, that's where the dislike comes from.

[V8Thrasher]

So help me on this one....Is it "illegal" to ride up beside another bike at a stop light? Or is this some sort of "unspoken male code"? I've had cars pull up beside me at a light. This pissed me off. But if you're on a bike it seems like there is more than enough room...
I've seen others do it. I "assumed" it was OK. ???

If cars are pulling up to you in a lane, your way too far on one side. And its not illegal, group riders do it all the time, its more a courtesy thing. If I dont know the biker in front of me ill just pull up in the lane next to him, or be in the same lane just a little behind him/her.

[MikeK77]

Another reason: someone was looking at my bike, then makes the statement "Not bad"...so I asked "not bad? what do you mean"..I got the response "well, it's no Harley".

[Chuck A]

No answers here.
I wasn't aware that HDs were hated by other riders.
One of my best friends and regular riding partner rides Harleys.
He has a 2008 Sportster XL1200R and a 2009 Sportster XR1200.
They are just motorcycles. No hate on my part.
FWIW, I have a couple of Hondas.

I agree i didnt know there were haters, but there are a lot of people who not have a HD, most of my friends own HDs, and we have no ill feelings, i myself own several Kawasakis and they show no ill feelings towards my bikes

[Eye_m_no_angel]

CBDallas:

"Originally Posted by Eye_m_no_angel

Harley's now are designed to NOT change the primary gasket with each primary oil change.

"You're going to have to make up your mind which it is before an appropriate response can be provided.
Previously posted:
"No kidding, you replace the primary gasket each time you replace the primary oil, which is best done each time you replace the engine oil."


I’ll repost what I wrote:

“Harley's now are designed to NOT change the primary gasket with each primary oil change. What you change is the derby cover o-ring. They have made such improvements in quality and design that it is no longer needed to remove the primary cover and inspect the chain and chain tension until, I think, the 50,000 mile mark. On older Harley's, that was a pretty good idea.”

In other words, they changed the design. Newer ones don’t require a primary gasket change when you change the primary oil. I thought that was clear enough, but I suppose it wasn’t?

No, your opinions have not inflamed me, and I’m not trying to “prove” you’re wrong. I can’t really “prove” anything on here, can I? In truth, we can’t even really have an intelligent discussion about Harleys, or their design philosophy, (which you don’t approve of,) because you don’t understand enough about them TO be able to discuss it. You’ve been subjected to the same sort of opinions, biases, half-truths, and outright lies, (both for AND against HD,) that many others have, and not been exposed to enough facts and realities. You don’t like the brand? Hey, that’s cool, and that’s your choice.

[Eye_m_no_angel]

SOOOOO....

Today Im on a nice ride...Im on a highway, I see a bike in front of me, that I happen to be catching on to. Im behind him for a little bit until I got tired of traffic passing me, so I happen to pass him. I did it at a somewhat slow pace, to take a look at the bike, and wait for a head turn to give him the whole "head nod" greeting....

DBag on a HD wouldn't even turn his head to acknowledge I was there, even though I was next to him for a good 30secs. So i basically did the "F U, throttle roll, leave in dust" move"

So your enjoyment of the ride is based on whether a guy on a Harley waves at you or not? Seriously?

For what it's worth, I don't wave at Herley's almost as much as I don't wave at other brands. <chuckle>

[Eye_m_no_angel]

Another reason: someone was looking at my bike, then makes the statement "Not bad"...so I asked "not bad? what do you mean"..I got the response "well, it's no Harley".

Well, it isn't a Harley now is it? What were you expecting him to say? "Oh man, I like your bike better then my Harley! (Or Suzuki or BMW or Ducati or whatever.)" Come on dude, of COURSE he's going to like his bike better. That's HIS bike.

If you were talking to me and said "Not bad" about my Harley I'd take it as a compliment! Especialy considering it's not the type you prefer.

[Hopper]

SOOOOO....

Today Im on a nice ride...Im on a highway, I see a bike in front of me, that I happen to be catching on to. Im behind him for a little bit until I got tired of traffic passing me, so I happen to pass him. I did it at a somewhat slow pace, to take a look at the bike, and wait for a head turn to give him the whole "head nod" greeting....

DBag on a HD wouldn't even turn his head to acknowledge I was there, even though I was next to him for a good 30secs. So i basically did the "F U, throttle roll, leave in dust" move"

Bet 10 to 1 that you did make him smile by getting out of one of his escape routes. Personally I never allow anyone I don't know, on a bike, in a car, and especially 18 wheelers ride or drive beside me. I will speed up or slow down, don't care, just get the heck away from me. If you go ahead and pass at the same speed you came up behind me, you get a wave and a smile but if you slow down beside me, I will slow down to give you a hint and wonder what that Dbag is doing. (your perspective is not the only one involved)
It is about respect for personal space of a rider that you do not know. Try it, and guarantee you will be treated differently. IMHO
Used to drive an 18 wheeler and referred to the 'buddy' drivers as the 'baby whale' syndrome, some folks would pull right in by the trailer like a baby whale getting close to mom and just stay there, not realizing how many things could go wrong. Put common sense first and make it safer for all your brothers and sisters. Oh, FYI: the brand of bike does not determine the 'Dbag' status of the rider. Skill, attitude, and etiquette will take care of that.
just an old school perspective.

ride safe and live long.

[markk53]

I wave at everything on two wheels. It's only scooter riders who won't wave back. When someone on a bike doesn't wave back, I figure he or she is probably preoccupied with something else.

Of course, there's probably posts on some forums somewhere saying "Guess what? Some *ssh*l* on a Harley waved at me today! :mad:"

Ya gotta realize some of them are either so new they're terrified to take a hand off the bars or they don't quite get it, acknowledging other riders.

But then again, I guess waving to others is kind of a U.S. thing. Some Europeans on the ADVriders forum have a kind of a "WTF is that all about?" attitude. I guess so many people ride over there for whatever reason that there is none of the acknowledgement of being riders.

[markk53]

CBDallas:

"Originally Posted by Eye_m_no_angel

Harley's now are designed to NOT change the primary gasket with each primary oil change.

"You're going to have to make up your mind which it is before an appropriate response can be provided.
Previously posted:
"No kidding, you replace the primary gasket each time you replace the primary oil, which is best done each time you replace the engine oil."


I’ll repost what I wrote:

“Harley's now are designed to NOT change the primary gasket with each primary oil change. What you change is the derby cover o-ring. They have made such improvements in quality and design that it is no longer needed to remove the primary cover and inspect the chain and chain tension until, I think, the 50,000 mile mark. On older Harley's, that was a pretty good idea.”

In other words, they changed the design. Newer ones don’t require a primary gasket change when you change the primary oil. I thought that was clear enough, but I suppose it wasn’t?

No, your opinions have not inflamed me, and I’m not trying to “prove” you’re wrong. I can’t really “prove” anything on here, can I? In truth, we can’t even really have an intelligent discussion about Harleys, or their design philosophy, (which you don’t approve of,) because you don’t understand enough about them TO be able to discuss it. You’ve been subjected to the same sort of opinions, biases, half-truths, and outright lies, (both for AND against HD,) that many others have, and not been exposed to enough facts and realities. You don’t like the brand? Hey, that’s cool, and that’s your choice.


Hey, at least you don't have to pull the exhaust loose and remove the front pipe to change the oil filter like some VStar 1100 riders do. (The ones that don't buy the remote filter kit and install it on the first oil change.)

[Maggie]

Well THANKS CharlesW and V8Thrasher.....
So nice to get some friendly advise. I NEVER ride beside anybody, I was referring to the "stoplight". And then I always let them go first. So I learned something today......I'll be more mindful of my lane positioning! :biggrin:

[CharlesW]

Well THANKS CharlesW and V8Thrasher.....
So nice to get some friendly advise. I NEVER ride beside anybody, I was referring to the "stoplight". And then I always let them go first. So I learned something today......I'll be more mindful of my lane positioning! :biggrin:
Rider reaction at stoplights varies a great deal.
Riding up alongside another rider upsets some, doesn't bother others.
I don't do it and that avoids any problem.

Another rider coming up alongside me at a stoplight doesn't really bother me.
Even being in the same lane is no problem as long as they give me somewhere near half of that lane.

On the road is a different story.
I don't want anyone I don't know riding alongside me for 30 second stretches even in a different lane.
Chances are, I would do what someone else mentioned, speed up or slow down to have some separation.

[zmago]

Ya gotta realize some of them are either so new they're terrified to take a hand off the bars or they don't quite get it, acknowledging other riders.

But then again, I guess waving to others is kind of a U.S. thing. Some Europeans on the ADVriders forum have a kind of a "WTF is that all about?" attitude. I guess so many people ride over there for whatever reason that there is none of the acknowledgement of being riders.

I think that motorcycle riders here in Europe are just as into the wave thing as North American riders, maybe even more so. I haven't noticed any "brand snobbery" either.

Maybe scooter riders just haven't gotten into waving. They never wave.

Postmen here drive yellow mopeds. One day about a month ago I was riding my XR and pulled up at a red light beside a postie on a moped. I flipped up my helmet and said "Nice day for a ride, isn't it?" He gave me a huge grin and a thumbs-up.

[Eye_m_no_angel]

Hey, at least you don't have to pull the exhaust loose and remove the front pipe to change the oil filter like some VStar 1100 riders do. (The ones that don't buy the remote filter kit and install it on the first oil change.)

Yanno, I think that no matter what you ride, or how great you know your brand is, there is something seriously fupped duck about the design, and often it's the simple little things.

It's like some engineers and designers just don't like technicians....<chuckle>

[markk53]

Working in a motorcycle sales/dealership and also in industry in heavy equipment, quality engineering, I've seen enough really mediocre engineering I've often said colleges should require a course in their engineering programs that deals with stupidity in engineering. I think they'd need a more PC title than that, but it would be the same thing. It's amazing how airheaded some engineers can be - and think they're infalable. I fixed a couple problems by simply moving a hole or set of holes 1/4" one way or the other. Rocket science it ain't. Just some thought. How hard would it have been for Yamaha to design the exhaust to allow the removal of the oil filter. Honda cut the frame so close on the old Magna V45 that sometimes the mechanics had to grind the weld to remove the carb set. 1/4" would have done the job.

Engineers should have to disassemble and reassemble the first production bike built to see what may need improvement.

[Maggie]

If cars pull up next to you in the same lane that you are occupying, you must be too far to the right. I always occupy the middle of the lane or left tire track of any lane when riding alone.

When I ride with friends, we never ride alongside of one another. It's just too dangerous. Heck, if someone rode next to me for 30 seconds, I'd be a little annoyed.

With friends, we often pull up next to one another at lights or stop signs. This enables us to clear the intersections quicker and as a unit. That being said, that's a total of 3-4 riders. I've never ridden in a larger group.

I wave to everyone. One of the best things about riding is being friendly.

THANK YOU......
also, I wave to everyone. It is one of the "cool" things about riding. Most HD riders DON'T wave back. It's cool. It used to bother me, but I think I've "grown" as a rider! :biggrin:

[V8Thrasher]

THANK YOU......
also, I wave to everyone. It is one of the "cool" things about riding. Most HD riders DON'T wave back. It's cool. It used to bother me, but I think I've "grown" as a rider! :biggrin:

I used to wave to everyone , now just when people wave first lol, but I do try to wave to each motorcyclist who engages in a wave first. I don't discriminate, I've had gold wings, Harley's( I ride a V Rod), little Honda cruisers, sportsbikes etc. I just wave whenever waved at. I dont initiate the wave lol

[Eye_m_no_angel]

"THANK YOU......
also, I wave to everyone. It is one of the "cool" things about riding. Most HD riders DON'T wave back. It's cool. It used to bother me, but I think I've "grown" as a rider! "

Good for you, and keep growing! Eventualy, (if you keep riding,) you'll have enough growth to understand that whether people on other bikes wave back at you or not, is about the absolute lowest thing on the totem pole of importance of things that make up a ride. Grow Maggie, Grow!

[V8Thrasher]

^this man speaks nothing but truth.

[ReconLdr]

Working in a motorcycle sales/dealership and also in industry in heavy equipment, quality engineering, I've seen enough really mediocre engineering I've often said colleges should require a course in their engineering programs that deals with stupidity in engineering. I think they'd need a more PC title than that, but it would be the same thing. It's amazing how airheaded some engineers can be - and think they're infalable. I fixed a couple problems by simply moving a hole or set of holes 1/4" one way or the other. Rocket science it ain't. Just some thought. How hard would it have been for Yamaha to design the exhaust to allow the removal of the oil filter. Honda cut the frame so close on the old Magna V45 that sometimes the mechanics had to grind the weld to remove the carb set. 1/4" would have done the job.

Engineers should have to disassemble and reassemble the first production bike built to see what may need improvement.

This^^^. I spent 12 years in the automotive industry and I can attest that the guys designing this **** don't think about service and repairs during the design phase..... If they did, we wouldn't have starters under the intake manifold of a V8 and other jacked up designs like that....

I used to wave to everyone , now just when people wave first lol, but I do try to wave to each motorcyclist who engages in a wave first. I don't discriminate, I've had gold wings, Harley's( I ride a V Rod), little Honda cruisers, sportsbikes etc. I just wave whenever waved at. I dont initiate the wave lol

I see that Harley is going to your head already.... ;)

I get a lot of dirty looks from HD riders. In fact, I'm pretty sure some of them loathe me [or my Buell] more than metric riders. They still hold a grudge over the whole Buell/HD situation.... I had a HD/Buell Dealership tell me flat out "I don't want your money, get that ****ing Buell off my property!!"

Personally, I love HD motorcycles. I like the way they look and sound. Even though they pissed me off when they closed Buell, I will still buy one someday, just not from the jackwads that refused to service my Buell.

[V8Thrasher]

^ maybe just a bit ;p but in all seriousness, I'm too busy riding to really care about waving lol. I noticed people wave more on long empty roads than city riding. Which I completely understand.

[ClassicVW]

Be careful with the Harley boots. I bought a pair and only wore them about 10X and the entire bottom separated from the rest of the boot. It seems the one piece heel/sole is only glued on, and the stitches that are visible are only there for show and don't hold anything together. There was a very thin line of glue and it had dried out.

I also have a pair of boots that look identical to the lower boot in Raven's photo except for the fact that there is no zipper. I bought them at WalMart for $30. The uppers seem to be wearing out a bit fast, but hey, for $30 I'll buy a new pair every year and not complain!

[Hopper]

Be careful with the Harley boots. I bought a pair and only wore them about 10X and the entire bottom separated from the rest of the boot. It seems the one piece heel/sole is only glued on, and the stitches that are visible are only there for show and don't hold anything together. There was a very thin line of glue and it had dried out.

I also have a pair of boots that look identical to the lower boot in Raven's photo except for the fact that there is no zipper. I bought them at WalMart for $30. The uppers seem to be wearing out a bit fast, but hey, for $30 I'll buy a new pair every year and not complain!

Did you take the boots back the dealership and ask them to make it right? Just wondering, I have a pair of Bandera boots ( I don't do products by brand name) and they are as comfortable as any I have worn and I grew up in West Texas. I would be mad as a hornet if they would not stand behind their product and replace the boots or return the money.
Good luck and be safe

[ClassicVW]

I actually bought them at a different store, not a Harley Dealer. The soles felt heavy and stiff, I could tell breaking them in would be a process, so that is why I only wore them 10X. But by then a year had passed and I felt I would have a big problem trying to return them at that point, so I didn't.

[OTD]

I've got 7500 miles on my HD super conductors and except for a few scuffs they look like brand new. Also one of the most comfortable boots I've ever worn.

[Eye_m_no_angel]

The Harley name is so sought after and recognized that there are "Harley" products of all shapes and sizes sold at all kinds of stores and fleamarkets and on-line auction houses and so on. Kind of like other name brand products.

I suppose if I bought my woman a Dooney and Bourke bag from a street vendor in Chicago, and it failed, I would then get on-line and report that D&B makes lousy products? Not likely.

And, I bought my first pair of Harley boots at this time last year. I bought them from a dealership, (and that might be the most coin I've ever dropped at a dealership!) and I bought them because it was the style I was looking for, (engineer boots with a side zipper, a decent tread, and a good solid heel to hook on the pegs,) and because they didn't have silver bangles and baubles all over them that screamed "Harley Davidson."

12 months later the boots are comfortable, functionable, ride very well, and fit very well, and look like they will last me years and miles. (Might have to get a hard leather patch sewn on the left boot where the shifter pegs is.) Actualy, I have been VERY pleased with how they fit and feel, and these rock-solid, official Harley-Davidson boots were made in China.

I wonder why the Motor Company can't find an American manufacturer that can build a similar quality boot at a reasonable price like that?

[4Raven]

Be careful with the Harley boots. I bought a pair and only wore them about 10X and the entire bottom separated from the rest of the boot. It seems the one piece heel/sole is only glued on, and the stitches that are visible are only there for show and don't hold anything together. There was a very thin line of glue and it had dried out.

I also have a pair of boots that look identical to the lower boot in Raven's photo except for the fact that there is no zipper. I bought them at WalMart for $30. The uppers seem to be wearing out a bit fast, but hey, for $30 I'll buy a new pair every year and not complain!

The HD boots I have held together for over 20K miles so that impresses me, however the fact that I had to have a Physical Therapist rebuild the entire interior doesn't!

Be careful ClassicVW....those cheap boots don't hold up for one year? I don't know how much you ride...but I have already put on a little over 5K miles on that zippered pair of Ridges and just got a compliment on them the other day at the dealership, because they look spankin' brand new! No wearing anywhere. You may get away with a $30 pair of boots, but you want something substantial to stand up to a crash too...not tear apart like tissue paper!

[biltrite]

I'm new to this forum, but this was the first thread i noticed, i ride a 72 Honda cb500, i told a friend i wanted a vintage Harley someday, he went off about how expensive parts are and that Harley riders are weekend riders, why would i bother with a Harley. As much as i was put off by how stupid and elitlist he sounded, My point of view was who gives a rats ass when you ride or how much money you are willing to put into your bike, to each his own in my eyes. I'm still a huge Harley admirer i will own one some day, and as for my Honda i love that thing as well.

[4Raven]

I'm new to this forum, but this was the first thread i noticed, i ride a 72 Honda cb500, i told a friend i wanted a vintage Harley someday, he went off about how expensive parts are and that Harley riders are weekend riders, why would i bother with a Harley. As much as i was put off by how stupid and elitlist he sounded, My point of view was who gives a rats ass when you ride or how much money you are willing to put into your bike, to each his own in my eyes. I'm still a huge Harley admirer i will own one some day, and as for my Honda i love that thing as well.

Truth be told...that is all that really counts;).....we are all brought to this site because we all love to ride....it doesn't really matter what you ride....


# just as long as it has two wheels:coffeescreen::D

[Eye_m_no_angel]

Actualy, most vintage Harley parts are cheaper then those for many other brands. I was quite surprised at how reasonable it is to get stuff for a 50 or 60 year old bike. And there's lots of parts available too.

[ClassicVW]

no angel,

I hope your references to flea markets and street vendors wasn't directed toward me, because I bought the Harley boots from a reputable, nation-wide shoe store. The boots did look spectacular and I have no doubt they were genuine, but the glue process was flawed to say the least. No way to tell until you either take it apart or it falls apart, that the stiching is for show only. So it remains to be seen if others will have this problem, or maybe they improved on the manufacturing process.

Raven,

I wasn't expecting a lot from the cheap boots, and I don't use them much for riding, I wear them to work (indoors) because we wear a police uniform and the footwear has to be black.

[Hopper]

Just wanted to post a neat experience that my wife and I had today, seems like a good place for it.
My wife and I were riding west to Ft. Worth Tx. today on I-30 freeway and a young man came on to the freeway as we were passing an entry ramp, not sure what he was riding, M50 maybe, anyway it was a cool mid size cruiser. After he got on the freeway he pulled in behind us and hung there, running a straight line behind me, just close enough so that other traffic would not come between us. When I realized what he was doing, I started to take his position into account when changing lanes. He followed us for about 20 miles to his exit. When he started to exit we all waved and acknowledged a friendship. If he had ridden to our next stop, he would have been asked to join us. Brands really do not matter, It is the people riding them. I saw enough in 20 miles to know that he is a respectful competent rider and I hope we made his ride a little safer and more pleasant as he did ours. It would be really cool if he happened to belong to this forum.

It is all Good.:thumbsup:

[4Raven]

Nice story Hopper....that occassionally happens on my trips too...I might follow someone or vice versa...breaks the monotony of a long ride....I think before I ride next year I am going to have some cards made....with our forum web address made and my user name....that way as I meet people along the way I can share our site...I do when I talk to people but to actually have a small business card would be nice....I got the idea from a HD rider ...Martin when he was traveling across country and I met him while riding The Snake.

[Hopper]

Nice story Hopper....that occassionally happens on my trips too...I might follow someone or vice versa...breaks the monotony of a long ride....I think before I ride next year I am going to have some cards made....with our forum web address made and my user name....that way as I meet people along the way I can share our site...I do when I talk to people but to actually have a small business card would be nice....I got the idea from a HD rider ...Martin when he was traveling across country and I met him while riding The Snake.

Excellent idea 4Raven!

[OTD]

Truth be told...that is all that really counts;).....we are all brought to this site because we all love to ride....it doesn't really matter what you ride....


# just as long as it has two wheels:coffeescreen::D

It's a good thing Arnt doesn't come into this sub forum or you would have hurt his itty-bitty feelings with that statement.:wink:

[Hopper]

Maybe the folks that have a negative view of Harley Davidson have not considered how much they contributed to the freedom that we all enjoy. Doesn't matter if you ride one or not, they deserve respect for what they have done during war time.

Through the Teens
Harley-Davidson motorcycles accompanied General John J. "Black Jack" Pershing in pursuit of Pancho Villa after he attacked Columbus, NM in 1916. Harley-Davidson motorcycles proved their value as military hardware. Shortly after the Mexican foray, the U.S. was drawn into World War I – as were approximately 20,000 Harley-Davidson motorcycles. Motorcycles were a great aid in dispatching messages before the advent of reliable radio communications. Most of these motorcycles had sidecars which could be fitted with machine-gun mounts if needed.

World War II and the 1950s
During WWII, Harley-Davidson produced 88,000 motorcycles for the war effort, including the horizontally opposed, two-cylinder, shaft-drive XA 750 model. (They were never sold to the public and only 1,000 were made.) For its patriotic efforts, the Motor Company was awarded four prestigious Army-Navy "E" awards

Maybe that is where that little extra feeling of freedom comes from when I throw my leg over. :)

Ride Safe All

[Eye_m_no_angel]

^^ :thumbsup: